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Kyron Horman -- Missing 6/4/10 #3

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Post by khintx Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:42 pm

Jessie Dugard's step dad was the "main person of interest" and still considered a suspect until (miraculously!) she walked into a police station 19 years later and started to tell what happened to her. His life was ruined. He saw her being snatched and even tried to outrun the car.

kh

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Post by truthbtold Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:37 pm

[i]
by Piper Today at 10:33 am

Many of us here have always felt it was someone else at the school that day. Either a teacher, previous employee or contract worker, volunteer, older child......

Does LE really have a description of this person?
====================================
Piper, it sounds like LE does have a description and possibly an image (from blink site), I hope so. If they do, it's apparently too vague to narrow the field considerably and may explain the recent emails to the Skyline parents. I haven't ruled Terri completely out. But I haven't ruled anybody completely out and it's looking less likely that she's involved. Seems much more likely it was someone associated with the school or a stranger that capitalized on the open science fair. If Terri's innocent, I don't think she'll be officially cleared unless/until the guy is caught and swears she wasn't connected to him because it'll make a lot of people angry that LE and Kaine assured the public that it was an isolated incident and other kids in the area were not at risk.

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Post by Gracie Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:46 pm

KH said
Jessie Dugard's step dad was the "main person of interest" and still considered a suspect until (miraculously!) she walked into a police station 19 years later and started to tell what happened to her. His life was ruined. He saw her being snatched and even tried to outrun the car.

kh

Yep! And they had a whole schoolbus full of witnesses that LE didn't listen to either.
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Post by truthbtold Tue Dec 14, 2010 8:39 pm

khintx wrote:
I have personally feared that Kyron (well, his remains) might be found right there at the school one day. There are lost of "knooks and crannies" in a school. I hope LE has done enough investgation right there at the school.

Elphie wrote:
I keep getting this fantasy that two school bullies pushed him down an old well near the school, not thinking he would be really hurt. It got out of control and now they are afraid to confess what they did. I know it's not likely, but it keeps playing in my head like an old 50s movie.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Does anyone know if canines were used at and around the school? Did they hit on anything?
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Post by truthbtold Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:00 pm

AwaitingJustice said:
Yes..this case and the hatefest on stepdad, was somehow, kept out of the public.. for some rerason it didnt take off on the net like some cases do.. Onnce the net takes a case, the potential of it becoming high profile is much better... where there wud be no stopping the reporting and the hatefest..

===========================
Amber's mom didn't let her suspicions override the fact that there was no evidence, and she didn't let her marital problems take precedence over her missing daughter. Kaine did both.

Hey AJ, do you know if canines were used early on and if they hit on Kyron's scent at the school at all?
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Post by Sherry Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:17 pm

truthbtold wrote:AwaitingJustice said:
Yes..this case and the hatefest on stepdad, was somehow, kept out of the public.. for some rerason it didnt take off on the net like some cases do.. Onnce the net takes a case, the potential of it becoming high profile is much better... where there wud be no stopping the reporting and the hatefest..

===========================
Amber's mom didn't let her suspicions override the fact that there was no evidence, and she didn't let her marital problems take precedence over her missing daughter. Kaine did both.

Hey AJ, do you know if canines were used early on and if they hit on Kyron's scent at the school at all?

Great comparison between Amber's mom's actions as compared to Kaine's!

I read last night in an old news report from mid June that the day and night of Kyron's disappearance as well as the following day there was a thorough search of the school and the grounds and surrounding area of the school.
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Post by bebecat Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:27 pm

I think the school itself is clear but Kyron may well be within a few miles...
I do think he was put into a vehicle, less noticeable than an adult walking off with a child...

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Post by bebecat Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:35 pm

Yes dogs were used, I think inside and out at the school...I think it was stated that Kyron's scent was not picked up...not sure if that is normal in such a crowded area. But it makes me think he went from parking area away in a car, not on foot/carried toward the wooded area.

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Post by bebecat Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:26 pm

That was really sad about Amber's case...Amber touched my heart for some reason, I was kind of like her when I was a young teenager. I still think about her a lot, and her poor parents, her dad breaks my heart.

I know LE bungled that one, but they could not clear the stepdad to their satisfaction...I think MCSO is in the same place, but in Terri's case, the leaks about the MFH (to whatever extend it occurred...) and the sexting really did not help her...without those two things, I think a lot less people would be convinced she is guilty. And whatever is up with Dede's day did not help either-was she at the damned farm all day or not??

If nothing had happened with the MFH/divorce/sexting-I really think Terri would be a sympathetic character to most people. But it did, so she isn't. Doesn't prove guilt either way.

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Post by Sherry Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:38 pm

Law enforcement and prosecutors have a responsibility to share information with victims and their families concerning ongoing investigations, as well as an obligation to warn someone who might be in danger or is being threatened.

Oregon's ethics rules for lawyers prohibit prosecutors from making statements about an investigation if they're likely to be disseminated widely and be prejudicial, meaning they would make it harder for the accused to get a fair trial, Lininger said. But Oregon's ethics rules don't clearly regulate the indirect disclosure of information to the public, via the victim's family, he said.

http://alternate-theories.blogspot.com/2010/08/oregonian-admits-to-being-kaine-hormans.html

A good summation about all that K and D are releasing to the public. I was under the impression that LE wouldn't share any information from an investigation with families (like with the Anthony case-Cindy complained she wasn't getting any info from OCSO). Somehow, I think that it would hurt the investigation. Plus, it sounds like LE could say anything to make themselves look like they arte doing their jobs. And, what if they find out info on K or D? How do they share that? Maybe Terri is being used by MCSD.
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Post by truthbtold Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:39 pm

http://abcnews.go.com/US/Media/kyron-horman-missing-disappeared-elementary-school/story?id=10836677

Found this article about canines being used the day after the disappearance; doesn't say if they hit on anything. Now I want to know if they followed his scent to the parking lot or if they didn't hit on anything at all. Curious. In Amber's case, the dogs followed her scent all along the highway, ending right near where she was eventually found.

Lots of other articles about Harry Oakes and his professional canine org offering to donate services and search for Kyron one month after the disappearance. LE and Kaine refused his services; lots of controversy in comments about that decision.
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Post by Sherry Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:41 pm

The Oregonian is admitting what I have said all along: All the information from the investigation "leaked" to the media is coming from Kaine Horman, Desiree Young, and Tony Young. They also implied, but not admitted outright, that the media is being fed Kaine Horman's spin on the information given to them by law enforcement. As I also stated all along, the media has been controlled by Kaine Horman and the media is Kaine's sock puppets as the Oregonian is freely admitting.

~from the last link I posted~
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Post by Sherry Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:44 pm

truthbtold, it boggles my mind that politics and egos took precedence over letting Mr. Oakes search with his dogs. At least, that is Mr. Oakes opinion of it and he has seen happen all the years he was in LE.
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Post by bebecat Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:55 pm

I think Harry Oakes is a pice of crap, but that is just my opinion. He has posted some horrible things in his temper tamtrum about not being given whatever permission he wanted to search. No excuse for that. But there are clearly two camps, pro and anti HO and I don't want to open that can of worms.

I think it is pretty clear why Casey's parents were not getting info from LE, they felt/knew her daughter was guilty and were not about to tell them anything that might somehow help Casey's defense. With MCSO, I am dense...what do they get by having D&K talk about Terri? Why would MCSO care if the public thinks Terri did it? They still have to prove it and so far, with all the "help" from D&K, they clearly can't. I still have faith in juries, they will still want the state to prove Terri did this, not just that she is a bad person or a drunk, etc...

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Post by truthbtold Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:29 am

When we were all speculating about LE's reason for sending the recent email to Skyline parents, I could only think of 3 possibilities. I'm adding a fourth based on our discussions yesterday.

1. To publicly counteract claims that they have tunnel vision and have been singularly focused all along; predicting the defense tactics and nipping them in the bud
2. Because they haven't been able to substantiate the isolated incident theory after 6 months (ie they really were tunnel visioned) and they have no choice than to start all over and do what should have been 6 months ago
3. They believe that a specific someone suspicious was there but haven't been able to place him/her at the scene to date..."
4. They KNOW someone suspicious was at the school and is not on the existing list; they need to identify this person
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Post by Piper Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:42 am

I agree, I think they know whoever took Kyron is not on that list.
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Post by truthbtold Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:06 pm

Assume only the things that have been confirmed to be directly from Terri are true

1. Kyron was acting strangely recently and spacing out
2. Kyron wasn't happy in the home and wanted to live with his mom
3. Kyron had a doctor's appointment to determine what might be wrong (the doctor can easily confirm talking to Terri and mentioning mini-seizures; we haven't heard that the doctor denied or confirmed the conversation).

If it wasn't a random abduction, the perp was exposed to Kyron through school, Terri's circle, Kaine's circle, Terri & Kaine's circle... Could be a neighbor, could be an Intel or Mason friend, could be someone Terri or Kaine knew without the other's knowledge, Uncle Kristian's friend, a contract worker at the school... It's common for skilled predators to gain the trust of the whole family and/or community to get to kids. I'd imagine LE has been trying to determine anyone who had previous access to Kyron and isn't around anymore. If they have a physical description of the perp, even if vague, that's gotta help. I hope they didn't concentrate only on people associated with Terri individually, but also Kaine and people that lived nearby or worked around kids. Possibly someone close enough to know that Terri was investigating Kyron's behavior. Motive. Was James acting weird too? Why did James move out of the house? It might be related, but we don't know what inspired his move.

Whether it was random or Kyron was targeted, he was alleged to be timid, was used to trying to please adults with 2 sets of parents, and had recently been directed to obey adults more closely (according to K and D). Heartbreaking...
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Post by truthbtold Wed Dec 15, 2010 3:24 pm

AJ: I think your abduction of opportunity theory is the most likely scenario as well. I just want LE to consider ALL reasonable scenarios until they get this solved.

P.S. "The Changeling" was on cable a few nights ago. Talk about the lengths LE will go to solve a high profile missing child case when they're under public and political pressure. At least the corruption and tactics have improved in the last 50 years, though there is still a long way to go.
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Post by Mircea Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:27 pm

Sherry wrote:The Oregonian is admitting what I have said all along: All the information from the investigation "leaked" to the media is coming from Kaine Horman, Desiree Young, and Tony Young. They also implied, but not admitted outright, that the media is being fed Kaine Horman's spin on the information given to them by law enforcement. As I also stated all along, the media has been controlled by Kaine Horman and the media is Kaine's sock puppets as the Oregonian is freely admitting.

~from the last link I posted~

Thanks for that clarification. It doesn't pass the smell test.

He has been controlling and manipulating the media all along and you have to seriously wonder if he hasn't been controlling and manipulating law enforcement as well, and whether or not they realize they are or were being duped and played like fools.

awaiting justice wrote:On account of Staton, reassuring (in his presser) that they are still on track and feel the case will be resolved as well as saying they are still going in the same direction, is indicative they still believe their hunches...

You might want to re-read that article again. As we pointed out, Staton said no such thing. Since the Oregonian has admitted it gets all of its differently twisted info from Kaine, that is Kaine saying that and not Staton.



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Post by Sherry Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:52 pm

Mircea, I have gone through every news/presser items and cannot find anywhere where LE has said the things that Kaine is stating. I did find where Staton said that everyone was a suspect, not just Terri, and that was early in the investigation. What I have found was many statements by MCSO straightening out what the media has been led to believe (thanks to the threesome, D,K, and T).

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Post by LottieM Thu Dec 16, 2010 12:06 am

awaiting justice wrote:The reason I believe it was totally random (even if the perp was known to him and the other kids at school) is because who ever took him is most likely a ped...

I am just doubting that a targetted kidnapping wud have ever been carried out inside a school...

The chances an oppurtunity to get Kyron alone amongst all the students, teachers and on this day visitors too, wud lead me to believe they wud have been unsuccessful...

I think whoever took him, was looking for a child, and Kyron was the one who happened to be at the place where the pig was ..... I believe it cud have been any child .... and that the investigation wud have easily found something to be able to turn the community against who ever was easiest target from within their family... I dont think it is find to change ppls minds about others and make them appear bad, or to act strange.... unless of course it was a child who belonged to an authority figure ..then we wud have seen a different investigation and the dump wud have likely been checked..

Any child in a school setting wud likely listen to an adult, even if their listening skills werent always that great...An man cud have easily got a kid to obey whether it was with candy or promise of some..

Re: bolded part....does anyone remember Kaine talking about how he/they had been working on getting Kyron to LISTEN TO - as in obey- THE ADULTS AT SCHOOL? and Kyron had been doing better at it recent to his disappearance (according to Kaine).

If this was a focus Kyron had been being strongly encouraged to do just before he went missing, he might well have not asked any questions if an adult told him to 'come along' to anywhere!
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Post by Sherry Thu Dec 16, 2010 12:27 am

Concerning Skyline school-there were 8 side doors and none of them were monitored. How easy it would be for Kyron to follow an adult out of a door without detection if classes were back in session and no one was in the halls.

Something I'm curious about but am not sure it matters~were the groundskeepers of this school district given white trucks provided by the district? If so, that adds that many more white trucks (however many groundskeepers the school district has for their schools) to look out for. My husband, a retired groundskeeper of our local school district, said that even with background checks a pedophile can still get into the sytem. Most likely because they have never been arrested before. I also remember hubby telling me of the many times the rugrats would gather around them as they were trimming trees or planting them or such work and it drove the guys nuts with their abundant "why" questions. Its that easy for a child to go up to a groundskeeper or school worker when the school doesn't keep an eye out for their students and be snatched away.
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Post by January Thu Dec 16, 2010 12:58 am

khintx wrote:Jessie Dugard's step dad was the "main person of interest" and still considered a suspect until (miraculously!) she walked into a police station 19 years later and started to tell what happened to her. His life was ruined. He saw her being snatched and even tried to outrun the car.

kh


And he failed his polygraph. Sad

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Post by lc Thu Dec 16, 2010 10:49 am

Trinity, who apparently owns GLP, just deleted the Kyron thread. "I've had it with you Kyron tards," he said.

Where is SoCalKook going to take her "inside" information now?

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Post by bebecat Thu Dec 16, 2010 10:59 am

Ha, ha, no kidding about So Cal...guess we will have to watch to see where she and others pop up. She supposedly has a private thread from twitter or something, for all of her devoted believers.

I'm sure a bunch of those folks will surface on some other forums...they don't seem like the sort to stay quiet very long.

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Post by bebecat Thu Dec 16, 2010 2:45 pm

Do we know for a fact they did not check landfills just because it was not reported? In those early days they could have been doing that at the same time they were searching by the school-all media was focused on the school area for 10 days. The FBI was already there-they can't all be that narrow-minded and Terri-focused.

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Post by Sherry Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:02 pm

aj sez:
If we look at this investigation, clearly LE has the support of the community.. I havent read anything about the community being angry about anything so far in the investigation..which includes that many ppl in that community arent that upset that LE didnt even check thedumps...(and the reporters covering this sad story dont seem to have a prob either as no one seems to question LE as to whether they ever thought too, and why they never did....

I've heard the Oregonlive site would delete any comments that would criticize LE and/or make Terri out to be innocent of the disappearance of Kyron. One of those commentors started her own website-Alternate Theories.

I see that now LE is saying they are still focused on Terri if the media is to be believed. I don't see why not in this case but it sure seems like there was no such blatent statements aimed at Terri until the 6 month anniversay.
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Post by bebecat Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:40 pm

Let's not go all conspiracy theory here...OL may delete comments but from what I've seen, I wish they would delete even more. And Ive's seen leave plenty on there that are not pro-LE or pro-Kaine...

I think they did check the landfills in the early days but would not mention it, since everyone as convinced Kyron would be found alive and no one was even mentioning anything that might show otherwise-also that could be part of the reason they keep saying they have found no reason to believe he is dead.

I don't know if we can really find out...probably not until/unless there is ever a trial. And if they did check, the defense will say that is one more reason to believe he is not dead...catch 22...

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Post by truthbtold Thu Dec 16, 2010 11:05 pm

Peace to Kyron and all who love him. I hope he is found soon and whoever hurt him is brought to justice swiftly.

Correction from truthbtold:
In earlier discussions on the board, we cited examples of innocent family members who were vilified for having failed polys. I used Amber Dubois's stepdad (Dave Cave) as an example. Subsequently, I saw part of the 48 Hours episode again; Dave indicated that he had been summoned to the police station to take polys 8 times. I assumed it was because he had failed the first one, but realized he never said that in the episode (that I saw). I did some subsequent research and found the below article that states Dave volunteered and passed a poly shortly after Amber went missing. I cannot find anything to substantiate that he passed or failed any of 7 follow up polys. I now realize I posted an assumption as fact and wanted to clarify right away. I respect in the integrity of this board and its posters - many apologies for my mistake.
http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/escondido/article_17edfcec-657a-5398-8295-4b1ada991f56.html



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Post by Sherry Fri Dec 17, 2010 12:59 am

bebecat wrote:Let's not go all conspiracy theory here...OL may delete comments but from what I've seen, I wish they would delete even more. And Ive's seen leave plenty on there that are not pro-LE or pro-Kaine...(I have to agree-delete more...also, yes, I've seen those comments, too)I think they did check the landfills in the early days but would not mention it, since everyone as convinced Kyron would be found alive and no one was even mentioning anything that might show otherwise-also that could be part of the reason they keep saying they have found no reason to believe he is dead.

I don't know if we can really find out...probably not until/unless there is ever a trial. And if they did check, the defense will say that is one more reason to believe he is not dead...catch 22...

Good point as to why we may not know if the landfills have been searched. I would think if there are reports of waterways on Sauvie Island being searched we would also hear if the landfills had been searched too.
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Post by truthbtold Fri Dec 17, 2010 1:21 am

Hey AJ -
your citing of Dave as an example of LE tunnel vision on a family member without evidence was spot on. His reputation and relationships were greatly affected, and wrongfully so. I hope that's not happening to Terri Horman; Kyron deserves better.

It was me who mentioned that Dave failed polys and I sincerely believed that from the 48 hours episode. I thought it was a fact and was a major reason for his being targeted as the only POI. When I caught part of the episode again, I realized they never actually said he failed - it was misleading to the viewer and I bought into it hook, line and sinker. So, I did some research and can't substantiate his poly results one way or another. Looks like maybe he initially passed and they kept giving polys to ask different questions because they couldn't clear him. In any event, what I thought was fact I now realize was an assumption and just wanted to clarify and own my mistake. This is the only board that I post on because I appreciate the differing opinions, respectful exchanges, and opportunity to get new perspectives from the insightful posts; if we're wrong, we say so. Standing in the corner with my head hanging low (for a short time - honest mistake)... Sad
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Post by truthbtold Fri Dec 17, 2010 1:29 am

I wish an investigative journalist would ask specifically about the landfills. Curious. One things for sure - it takes a crew and a plan to carry it out. Such a search is usually reported by locals and covered by the media. Nancy Grace never misses a landfill or dump-site search (or a chance to show an unnamed POI standing shackled on a pier looking at alligator bones). I only know for sure that I've near seen a landfill search for Kyron specifically pointed out on the list of LE's efforts to date, and I haven't seen it covered in any media.

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Post by Mircea Fri Dec 17, 2010 4:18 pm

awaiting justice wrote:Reason is.. when someone has passed a lie detector test, it wud be EXTREMELY UNUSUAL to be asked to continue taking them 7 or 8 times...

No, it wouldn't be unusual at all, in fact it would be quite logical.

They gave her a polygraph test.

Shortly afterword, the came across more information, which results in the need for another polygraph.

After that, they came across more information, which resulted in the need for an additional polygraph, which she wisely refused because any fool could see where that was going.

It quite common to give a polygraph, then 3, 4, 6 or even 12 months later find new evidence and call people back for additional polygraphs.

The only thing it proves is that people took additional polygraphs, it doesn't prove they failed the first one. In any event, the police never said she failed the polygraphs. It was Kaine who said she failed the polygraphs. Someone said they thought they read where she claimed she failed a polygraph, but then how did she know that? Did Kaine tell her? Well, there you go.






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Post by bebecat Fri Dec 17, 2010 4:54 pm

I watched a show on E today about Mikelle Biggs, who was taken from in front of her home a decade or more ago, and has never been found. Her father failed all of his LD tests but is not a suspect, LE has a suspect already in prison but cannot prove anything against him. LE did suspect Mikelle's dad for a while, but eventually ruled him out; it was clear she was taken by force, from her bicycle, the wheel was still spinning when found. Her father would not have had to do that. Anyway, I am all about not putting too much creedence on LD tests. But I wish Terri didn't "appear" guilty in other ways...mainly the lack of reaction overlosing her daughter. That, and the content of the sexting, are troublesome to me. I've read all the of explanations...but can't quite overcome either in my own mind as yet. Still, I would not convict at this point.

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Post by bebecat Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:37 pm

By lack of reaction at losing her daughter, I mean lack of a legal reaction...I don't expect to speak publicly about it.

And I do believe, unless it comes out otherwise, that the texts are accurate and correct.

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Post by truthbtold Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:09 pm

Awaiting Justice said:
It is illogical to think Terri had anything to do with Kyrons disappearance... I wish more ppl wud see how stupid the idea of Terri being involved really is... meanwhile the likely monster pig is out there, only to harm others...



I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's illogical to consider Terri or another family member may be complicit in the chain of events that lead to Kyron's disappearance (knowingly or unknowingly). There's enough strange behavior in this case to justify people logically considering Terri or another family member might be involved, imo. It's only wrong for LE and other family members to accuse someone and leak unconfirmed prejudicial information to publicly persecute them without evidence, imo.

Without confirmed evidence in this case, we are all just stating our opinions about who might be involved; haven't read any outlandish opinions so far on this board. My opinion has changed a few times during the past 6 months. At this point, I think that any of the parents could somehow be involved (directly or indirectly), but it's unlikely. I am now leaning towards a pedophile abduction and that Kyron was not specifically targeted through family association. Random victim of opportunity seems most likely to me, but new evidence or verified information could change my opinion (again).
Very Happy
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Post by bebecat Fri Dec 17, 2010 8:10 pm

I don't think it is narrow-minded to believe that texts to possibly be used in a court case are probably accurate, unless proven otherwise.

I'm not convinced Terri is guilty, but nor am I convinced she is not.

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Post by truthbtold Fri Dec 17, 2010 9:52 pm

by awaiting justice Today at 5:47 pm

Good post supporting the opinion that no family member abducted Kyron. To add to your reasoning, I believe that LE has been very focused on the family since the get-go, especially Terri. If they haven't been able to crack anyone in the family and they haven't produced any evidence against a family member in six months, it is less likely that a family member is responsible, imo.

I think LE has been following an investigative strategy something like this in order to find the perp that will lead them to Kyron:

1. Did one of the parents physically abduct Kyron?
NO. ALIBIS CONFIRMED FOR TIME OF ABDUCTION.

2. Did one of the parents participate in a conspiracy to have Kyron abducted; whereby an accomplice or hired kidnapper physically removed the child from the school?
NO EVIDENCE UNCOVERED; OPEN POSSIBILITY

3. Was some known person outside the family taking an unusual interest in Kyron; someone who was at the school on June 4 2010?
NO SUCH PERSON IDENTIFIED BY FAMILY, FRIENDS OR SCHOOL STAFF THUS FAR. UNLIKELY.

4. Was there a pedophile at the school who had an opportunity to trick or forcibly remove Kyron on June 4 2010?.
POSSIBLY; SCHOOL WAS OPEN TO THE PUBLIC AND MORE ADULTS THAN USUAL WERE PRESENT.
ACTIONS:
a. INVESTIGATION UNDERWAY TO DETERMINE ALL PEOPLE PRESENT AT THE SCHOOL -- BACKGROUND CHECKS UNDERWAY.
b. CHECK ALL SEX OFFENDERS IN THE AREA AND IDENTIFY THOSE WITHOUT ALIBI ON JUNE 4 2010 BETWEEN 8 AM AND NOON; INTERROGATE THOSE WHO ARE UNACCOUNTED FOR DURING THIS TIME.
c. CHECK FOR SIMILAR KIDNAPPINGS FROM SCHOOL GROUNDS ACROSS THE COUNTRY; CHECK FOR SIMILAR RECENT ABDUCTIONS IN THE STATE; CHECK LOCAL POLICE REPORTS FOR ATTEMPTED ABDUCTIONS IN THE AREA IN THE MONTHS LEADING UP TO AND FOLLOWING KYRON'S ABDUCTION.

At present, I think they're focusing on tasks 2 and 4. I also think it's possible that LE uncovered some minor criminal activity in the family, and a major criminal network outside the family during the course of their investigation. They are having a hard time figuring out what is and what isn't related to Kyron's disappearance. JMO.

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Post by Sherry Fri Dec 17, 2010 11:54 pm

What is anyone's opinion that there are two investigations going on like there was for Susan Smith-one that was public knowledge pointing away from her and one on the inside quietly pointing to her? I've heard this mentioned as possibly being done so I'm just wondering if its plausible to think it. I know many have said that it could be that Terri is helping LE.

Another thing that has come to mind-if the MFH is for real and the landscaper did testify to the GJ about it, why wasn't he arrested?

tbt, I liked reading your investigation summary. Were/are you in LE?
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Post by Sherry Sat Dec 18, 2010 12:30 am

good point, aj, about the dumps being searched and we'd know about it if there were two investigations going on. Unless LE already knew there was no reason to search them? IDK~

On the murder for hire-the landscaper testified to it at the GJ-i.e., he admitted to being a party to a crime. I don't believe there was a MFH plot by Terri. I'm just asking out of curiosity.
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Post by Piper Sat Dec 18, 2010 12:37 am

Remember, we have a live chat! Bottom of screen on the forum page!
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Post by bebecat Sat Dec 18, 2010 12:43 am

The landscaper may have testified more about his relationship with Terri than any MFH plot, for all we know...they may have wanted to know about if he knew Kyron, how Terri acted around Kyron, whatever.

I don't believe LE is using Terri behind the scenes; she would not need such a high-priced attorney if that were the case.

LE may have become aware of some smaller crimes that they are not interested in charging at this time, in which case there would not be any public records...some of which could be the things they wish they did not know. There's been plenty of gossip and rumors, take your pick.

I think they are learning lots, but not the right stuff. The more time that passes, the worse for LE, no matter who is the guilty party.

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Post by truthbtold Sat Dec 18, 2010 1:12 am

Sherry,

I think there are parallel investigations underway because of the number and type of LE agencies involved; it's not like missing persons cases I've seen before. Something far-reaching is being investigated, imo. We only hear about gossipy stuff fed to Kaine and Desiree from LE because anything important is being held close to the vest. There is more than one perp and one child involved and LE can't tip anyone off. (I wonder if Haleigh's case could have been solved if the same amount of expertise and budget were allocated.)

Terri might be a material witness if she was knowingly or unknowingly involved in something that contributed to Kyron's disappearance (or something else criminal that was uncovered during the investigation). It would explain why she seems to be sequestered from press and virtually silent; she could be answering to not only her lawyer, but LE as well. It's possible. It seems likely to me that someone's got some major goods on Terri and she's got to get herself out of a jam. Someone as expressive as she would be fighting back against the public lynching and fighting for Kiara if she could. For some reason, she can't right now. I don't think she is directly responsible for Kyron's disappearance, but she's got some legal problems imo.

Just speculation on my part. I am not connected to LE.
good night
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Post by Maat Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:40 am

RE: the sexting.

Didn't they show that the number RECEIVING the sexts actually belonged to Kaine?

IF it is even true texts, is it possible that Terri was sending those to her husband? Kaine has the ability to change those around. We have NOTHING proving they were reported accurately, in the correct order, and not twisted around. We do see when the discussion shifts to concern about children, they suddenly stop right there and the time changes to avoid any discussion about her being a concerned parent.

The thing that sticks in my mind is the number is KAINE'S! Which screeches, either she was talking to her husband, she didn't send them, or Kaine is a lot more involved with MC than he has let on.
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Post by Sherry Sat Dec 18, 2010 11:10 am

Thanks, bebecat, truthbtold, and awaiting justice for your replies. You make good sense even though there's differences of opinions. And, now I understand a bit more about Oregon's GJs.

Maat, I've heard that the pictures of Terri sent to MC were of her bodybuilding shots, nothing more, and nothing x-rated. MC supposedly told Dateline that he did sext with Terri but never had sex with her. It is suspect about those sexts since that phone was in Kaine's name. What mother can talk "dirty" to someone then abruptly go to caring about her daughter's needs? Hinky~
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Post by johnabelle Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:24 pm

Many have thought the sex/text messages showed that Terri didn't care about Kyron. I haven't been convinced that she sent them herself, but even if she did, IMO, they were sent a month after Kyron disappeared and do not prove she had anything to do with harming Kyron.

People have a double standard. When TJ posted the following information on GLP's they were saying they didn't know why anyone thought it would make Kaine look "bad" and as far as they were concerned it had nothing to do with Kyron and even if it was true about the 3some, that's how some men are.

On godlikeproductions, TJ, who is supposedly a cousin of dede's, was asked if he had talked to LE recently? He posted the following comments. This is a complete 180 turn from what he's been saying about her being innocent.

Yes, I called them yesterday, but got the answering machine.
I left a message and my number.
They already have it tho.
I have called them before and talked to a detective but about someone who got into my van and reprogrammed my GPS.
I posted about it here as an ac.
Said I didn't want to walk, remember?
WiKT responded to it guessing it was me.
I was a little reluctant to spill on the steroids and the threesome.
The sex was happening when Dede was in shape as far as I can tell.
She said that Kaine was way nicer when she was skinny.
I get it better now, I'm not a chubby chaser either.
The steriods she said Kaine wrote a check for, that sounds dumb to me, how many drug dealers take checks these days?!!
True or not it shows that Dede had and was exposed to very personal knowledge of Terri and her ways. You wouldhave to be close to someone to trust them with that info, I would think anyway.
As well as the humping thing.
She told me Terri said kaine did nothing about it and refused to acknowledge the problem.
That is a big slam too, true or not it shows Terri was thinking Kaine was not going to help her. Sympathy? I don't know.
But it was bonding the two more.
They were closer then she ever said.
She was not being truthful at all, told ya it would be dumb to do.
I was trying to see all I could.
I knew things were off the first day but I didn't have enough to go with and I just kept her talkin.
I like to let people talk, it makes it easy to see how full of crap they are.
As far as my family goes, what ever, if anyone want to disown me for trying to find out the truth about a missing little boy then see ya.
If you want to post what an asshole I am and how you would never want me in your family fine, get in line.
This is about the disappearance of a child.
My kids are on the streets and schools here.
My loyalties are to Kyron and the truth.
There is definitly more to it then I was told.
I knew it right off, but wasn't sure how to process it.
As I read up on solved cases on women who killed childern and their own kids I could see better the mind of these people.
It is entirely possible that the two did this, but the announcement of a third person is weirder yet.
If Terri and Dede were/are lovers the plot becomes more believeable.
If I knew there was some artist that could come along and say yep I saw here, waved to her, then I sure as hell would be lookin for his ass
and now.
The revelation by my ex is not unusual, she is not keeping up on the case whatsoever and she had no idea how important the two being proved to be lovers was to tying them together and showing deception on their part.
I want to k ow why my Uncle is fine with Dede not talikng the test.
He is a sherriff, does he not trust them either?
Or is the potential truth too scary to swallow.
Just sweep it under the carpet, just like the family wanted to do with my dad.
Things kept seceret repeat. Said that a long time ago here too.
I don't care about the ramifications for me, this is bigger then me or family.
It has to be solved, it cannot be allowed to go cold.
I want to be proved wrong. Do it Dede, prove me to be wrong.
They are closing the gap and you already think your going to be endited.
Do the right thing and take the test and tell the truth.
If there is a third involved then you know they are figuring it out.
The nail tech girl is not Andrea. She has a shop in Beaverton tho.

On my first thread I said I was crazy like a fox.
Now do you get it Guest reader?
Stratagy nurse rachett.
I'm fine, now maybe I can sleep tonight.
Sorry Kaine but it was bigger than you.
Peace.

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Post by johnabelle Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:34 pm

What day exactly was it that Dede moved in with Terri?
I know Dede posted on Terri's fb wall on the 5th and there were some comments made that Terri didn't respond to the post.
Who contacted dede? It wasn't Terri. Was it Terri's mom because a friend suggested Dede might could stay with her?
There is so much information or rumors in this case I can't remember all the details.

When would Terri and Dede have planned this elaborate scheme to take Kyron from school? If I remember correctly, they hadn't spoken or seen each other since Terri's birthday party in March.
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Post by Mircea Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:30 pm

Maat wrote:RE: the sexting.

Didn't they show that the number RECEIVING the sexts actually belonged to Kaine?

Yes.

Kaine purchased the cell-phones.
Kaine gave one of the cell-phones to Terri and kept the other for himself.
When the end is known, we'll find out that Kaine was with Michael and it was Kaine through Michael who instigated the alleged "sexting."
From what we know now, none of the text messages appear to be of a sexual nature and there appear to be no photos that were texted from Terri to Michael.

That's also how the alleged "murder for hire" plot appears to be working out.

From that you can conclude that Kaine has been trying to frame Terri for whatever reason, either because he is the actual perpetrator or because he has come to believe she is, except that his act appears more to be trying to convince himself that she is, coupled with his constantly changing story and changing personal appearance, he is more likely involved that Terri.

On godlikeproductions...

GLP is neither authoritative or credible. It is the greatest collection of kooks, nuts and psychos. I'm willing to bet the person who claims to be a cousin has an IP Address nowhere in Oregon or near the state of Oregon.



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Post by truthbtold Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:42 pm

I think the sexts are so completely irrelevant that they won't end up being admitted as evidence in a criminal trial if Terri is ever prosecuted, authentic or not. They were only relevant to Terri's character/suitability in family court. Even that was a long shot - not sure it mattered much to the judge. The MFH allegations were probably the driving force for the judge granting Kaine's request for custody and RO. Kiara's safety was at risk if the judge considered there was the slightest possibility that the MFH allegations might be true; the sexting was petty garnish.

If they are authentic:
Big whoop (and I would say the same thing if it was Kaine sexting someone other than Terri one month after the disappearance). You've lost your stepson, you've had your child taken away, you've felt neglected by your husband for a long time and now he's accused you of the unthinkable very publicly, you can't talk to your friends, you are isolated... People do strange things in strange circumstances and looking for any form of comfort or confirmation that you're desirable in this situation doesn't shock me at all. It in no way implies to me she did not care about Kyron, nor does it reflect on her suitability as a custodial parent to Kiara.

If they are not authentic:
--Could be that they were texts sent to Kaine and manipulated to appear that MC was the second party (with MC's consent) as ammunition for the custody and restraining order motions. Character assassination, worse things happen every day in divorce court - still unacceptable.
--Could be they were between Terri and MC, and MC forwarded them to Kaine, who then provided them to LE (so the text records were ultimately pulled from Kaine's phone). Altered or not, this would probably make them inadmissable because the original court filing by Kaine's lawyer stated they were obtained from MC's phone, but the evidence document filing shows the phone records came from a number registered to Kaine Horman's account. Suspicious and hard to argue that the messages haven't been manipulated.


Last edited by truthbtold on Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:49 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by bebecat Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:02 pm

Wonder where all the GLP posters went when their board shut down? Do they have another site?

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