Rebecca Zahau Found Dead at Historic Mansion 7/13/11

ThirdEye wrote:True, they did say it was suspicious in the beginning, but all the evidence told them otherwise - that it was a suicide. I have followed this case from the beginning, and I still believe the investigators got it right.

-- Told whom? Certainly, there are many who would disagree. Including the family.

-- Interesting your opinion, I am sure.

ThirdEye wrote:HinkySD, funny how you see Adam as a "POS" and I see him as someone who valiantly tried to save Rebecca...all before he'd even had a cup o' joe. That's a hero to me.

CPR on Rebecca:
Are you sure AS tried CPR?
What did that entail?
Perhaps, untying her hands, straightening her jaw, removing the rope from her neck before the first breathe in?
Which of these did he do?
That's what I though.
So he lied, right?
He lied about that "girl" you say he went to McDonald's with.
LOL

Freckles, I said it told the investigators what happened. By investigators, I mean the 6-15 trained detectives that saw the scene and collected the evidence. The only family that doesn't believe the findings are the Zahaus, which is not surprising...suicide is very hard for any family to accept and Rebecca killed herself in such an odd way.

I do think Adam attempted CPR on Rebecca and have listened to the tape. I don't know what he did and neither do you because neither one of us was there (as far as I know). Why do you assume he lied?

You cannot perform CPR on a person laying on their arms/wrists bound behind them.

Adam didn't even loosen the "noose".

IMO: There was no attempt to get "air" into RZ.

Jessica2 wrote:
clipped for space-

@HinkySD, leave cute Adam alone. Poor guy.
You are right, every point cannot be explained with the information available from when Rebecca was found.

And there are those who thought Ted Bundy was cute, too.
Make life a lot easier if the bad guys were all ugly and had tats on the forehead reading, "Hello. My name is Bad Guy." At the same time, there are certain women who are attracted to the "bad but cute" ones. Charile Manson and Richard Ramirez and Scott Peterson all have their fan bases.

Looks have nothing to do with character, you know?

ThirdEye wrote:Freckles, I said it told the investigators what happened. By investigators, I mean the 6-15 trained detectives that saw the scene and collected the evidence. The only family that doesn't believe the findings are the Zahaus, which is not surprising...suicide is very hard for any family to accept and Rebecca killed herself in such an odd way.

I do think Adam attempted CPR on Rebecca and have listened to the tape. I don't know what he did and neither do you because neither one of us was there (as far as I know). Why do you assume he lied?

I disagree with your statement. How extensive was this survey you are referring to?
It is impossible for him to have attempted CPR.
IF you knew anything about CPR, you would realize that he could not even have attempted it.

Puzzler wrote:You cannot perform CPR on a person laying on their arms/wrists bound behind them.

Adam didn't even loosen the "noose".

IMO: There was no attempt to get "air" into RZ.

Damn! You mean to say CPR can not be done on a person in full blown rigor?
You are telling me there was no way to massage that heart and force the blood to the brain?
By blowing into her mouth AS could not have inflated the lungs?
All because of the rigor?

Yep. That is what I thought, too!

HinkySD wrote:San Diego's Mayor race update:

31% Carl DeMaio
28% Bob Filner
23% Nathan Fletcher
11% Bonnie Dumanis (The current mute San Diego District Attorney)
3% Other
4% Undecided

Careful, careful, now.... Dumanis has billionaire Irwin Jacobs in her pocket. Anything could change, but let's hope not!



Read for yourself at:
http://www.10news.com/news/31135747/detail.html?treets=sand&tml=sand_break&ts=T&tmi=sand_break_1_01570105312012

HinkyinSD - TY

ThirdEye wrote:Freckles, I said it told the investigators what happened. By investigators, I mean the 6-15 trained detectives that saw the scene and collected the evidence. The only family that doesn't believe the findings are the Zahaus, which is not surprising...suicide is very hard for any family to accept and Rebecca killed herself in such an odd way.

I do think Adam attempted CPR on Rebecca and have listened to the tape. I don't know what he did and neither do you because neither one of us was there (as far as I know). Why do you assume he lied?

--- You don't know what he did and yet you believe him? Wow. If I was a defense atty, I'd want you on a jury! You want to believe and so you do. Sorry. I will question until the answers are apparent.

Freckles, I do know a lot about CPR and I think anyone in his situation would have attempted to revive her. Maybe you have some unique ability to know when CPR is no longer needed in an emergency situation, but I certainly don't and would have done all I could to try to save her.

Pretty harsh things to say about someone who just happened in to a horrible situation. I think Adam tried his best to get her down as quickly as he could. It was a shocking sight I'm sure, and I don't think any of use can say what we would do in such a situation. Walk a mile in someone's shoes and all that?

When I said the only family that didn't believe the findings were the Zahaus, I meant the Shacknais and Romanos accept the findings. And those three families are the only ones involved. The Zahaus initially believed the investigation, until lawyers got involved.

You seem to be taking what I'm saying personally. Rebecca's death has been ruled a suicide, so you are really the one that should be defending your position with facts...comparing people to serial killers does nothing for the conversation, IMO.

Freckles wrote: --- You don't know what he did and yet you believe him? Wow. If I was a defense atty, I'd want you on a jury! You want to believe and so you do. Sorry. I will question until the answers are apparent.

You don't know what he did but you DON't believe him? Based on what? Because you want to believe he is like Charles Manson or Scott Peterson? You would never even make it on a jury! Besides, this case is closed and it was suicide...Adam had nothing to do with it, only Rebecca did.

The "anyone" in "this" situation, happens to be Adam.

We know that Adam did "not" "even" loosen the noose around RZ's neck.

Autopsy Report indicate "two" red lines around Rebecca's neck.

One thin horizontal line.

One thicker line made by the rope, with an inverted "V" at the back of her ear.

How did that horizontal line get there?

Well Puzzler, most of use wouldn't do everything perfectly in such a crazy situation. The thin line was probably from the t-shirt she wrapped around her neck. That's all that was there...the noose and a t-shirt, so it came from one or the other.

Freckles wrote:

Jessica2 wrote:
clipped for space-

@HinkySD, leave cute Adam alone. Poor guy.
You are right, every point cannot be explained with the information available from when Rebecca was found.

And there are those who thought Ted Bundy was cute, too.
Make life a lot easier if the bad guys were all ugly and had tats on the forehead reading, "Hello. My name is Bad Guy." At the same time, there are certain women who are attracted to the "bad but cute" ones. Charile Manson and Richard Ramirez and Scott Peterson all have their fan bases.

Looks have nothing to do with character, you know?

@Freckles- I did not want to put this out there, but Adam is a really really nice guy. I think that whole family is super nice. I always think like this, if someone talks to another person who likes you, that other person will sing your praises. If they talk to someone who does not like you, then they will speak negative about you. You don't know anything about Adam's character, and he is nothing like what all of you believe.The whole family is nothing like what you believe. Jonah LOVED Rebecca. That is all I will say.

Jessica said" "@Freckles- I did not want to put this out there, but Adam is a really
really nice guy. I think that whole family is super nice. I always think
like this, if someone talks to another person who likes you, that other
person will sing your praises. If they talk to someone who does not
like you, then they will speak negative about you. You don't know
anything about Adam's character, and he is nothing like what all of you
believe.The whole family is nothing like what you believe. Jonah LOVED
Rebecca. That is all I will say."

Again I ask, what does being a "nice person" have to do with this?

I disagree with the conclusion re speaking nicely/poorly about someone.
I don't rely on the relationships others have to form my own opinions of liking/not liking someone. And there is no need for me to "like" or "not like" any member of this saga. After all, I am not forming a relationship with any of them!

Based upon what you are saying, you sound like you have a personal relationship with someone of them. And you want me to "like" them because you do! Well, that would be your relationship, not mine. I don't know you from Adam so why would I care whether you want me to like specific people? Of course, if you like them, you want others to do the same. That is what you said, right?

Sorry. Liking someone has nothing to do with the murder and coverup of Rebecca. So you may like anyone you choose, okay? It does not follow I must trail behind your lead simply because you say so, right?

Freckles wrote:Jessica said" "@Freckles- I did not want to put this out there, but Adam is a really
really nice guy. I think that whole family is super nice. I always think
like this, if someone talks to another person who likes you, that other
person will sing your praises. If they talk to someone who does not
like you, then they will speak negative about you. You don't know
anything about Adam's character, and he is nothing like what all of you
believe.The whole family is nothing like what you believe. Jonah LOVED
Rebecca. That is all I will say."

Again I ask, what does being a "nice person" have to do with this?

I disagree with the conclusion re speaking nicely/poorly about someone.
I don't rely on the relationships others have to form my own opinions of liking/not liking someone. And there is no need for me to "like" or "not like" any member of this saga. After all, I am not forming a relationship with any of them!

Based upon what you are saying, you sound like you have a personal relationship with someone of them. And you want me to "like" them because you do! Well, that would be your relationship, not mine. I don't know you from Adam so why would I care whether you want me to like specific people? Of course, if you like them, you want others to do the same. That is what you said, right?

Sorry. Liking someone has nothing to do with the murder and coverup of Rebecca. So you may like anyone you choose, okay? It does not follow I must trail behind your lead simply because you say so, right?

@Freckles-Respectfully, you don't know them, you are reading things in the tabloids, and forming an opinion based on that. It was in response to "looks have nothing to do with character" and comparing him to Ted Bundy. I don't expect you to like anyone, just stating my opinion like you state yours. I don't assume you are trying to change my mind, neither am I trying to change yours.

So Freckles, since you say you don't know him, on what do you base your assertion that Adam is a serial killer?

A few may believe a thin red line was left by a bulky T-shirt, but not I.

To each their own.

Whoa, What goes here? I cannot believe we are still fighting over whether Rebecca committed suicide or had help. If you believe what has been determined by the authorities, fine. If you believe otherwise, that is fine too.
No reason to get testy just because some of feel this case was closed to quickly. There are a lot of things Re; this case that just don't add up, and those who feel the case merits more investigation certainly are entitled to their opinions. I don't get why some are so offended that we exercise our right to express this opinion.

I discovered a body within less than two hours of death and knew no amount of CPR was going to bring the person back. How Adam might have thought there was any chance for Rebecca is unimaginable. It was obvious the person was dead, and I'm sure it was just as obvious to Adam that Rebecca was dead.

HinkySD wrote:There's so much to talk about!

The police reports state that Adam called 911 at 6:48am. 'Girl Hung herself!' This is also the time that Adam reportedly sent a text to Jonah. 'Girl hung herself.' It was not reported that Adam asked Jonah for HELP to SAVE Rebecca.

If Adam is in the MOOD to save Rebecca, (he is telling 911 that he wants to cut her down, ungag her, loosen her arm bindings, and give her chest compressions) why isn't he asking Jonah for HELP? Supposedly in his mind Rebecca is saveable, right? Where's the 'GET YOUR ASS HOME AND HELP ME!' text?

Why 'Girl Hung herself' to Jonah? Why did Jonah call Dina to report to her that Rebecca committed suicide? (Adam was going to save her, right?)

DURING Adam's important life saving excursion of moseying to the kitchen for knives, grabbing and dragging a small table for easier cutting? LIFE SAVING MODE??? What a LIE! If you want to save someone's life you do not text and make phone calls! You GET TO IT!

Reminder: 1) Adam never rushes to the body to take the pressure off the noose. 2) Adam never loosens the noose after he cuts Rebecca down.

HinkySD, isn't this what you wrote? What did you mean? If Adam HAD sent Jonah a text before he called 911, THAT would've been HINKY! Maybe you can explain? And explain your thoughts about Adam and what role he played in Rebecca's death?

Let's all play nice.

HinkySD, I really don't understand what you are saying or where you are coming from. I asked you to explain a post twice, you said you never said it, so I found it for your reference. Is it wrong to ask another poster to explain a posting? I truly do not understand what you are upset about.

There is no record of when Adam sent his text to Jonah that morning, that I am aware of. If there is, could you please give the link?

ThirdEye wrote:HinkySD, I really don't understand what you are saying or where you are coming from. I asked you to explain a post twice, you said you never said it, so I found it for your reference. Is it wrong to ask another poster to explain a posting? I truly do not understand what you are upset about.

@ThirdEye- You seem like such a genuinely nice person. I really appreciate reading your respectful posts.

ThirdEye wrote:

HinkySD wrote:There's so much to talk about!

The police reports state that Adam called 911 at 6:48am. 'Girl Hung herself!' This is also the time that Adam reportedly sent a text to Jonah. 'Girl hung herself.' It was not reported that Adam asked Jonah for HELP to SAVE Rebecca.

If Adam is in the MOOD to save Rebecca, (he is telling 911 that he wants to cut her down, ungag her, loosen her arm bindings, and give her chest compressions) why isn't he asking Jonah for HELP? Supposedly in his mind Rebecca is saveable, right? Where's the 'GET YOUR ASS HOME AND HELP ME!' text?

Why 'Girl Hung herself' to Jonah? Why did Jonah call Dina to report to her that Rebecca committed suicide? (Adam was going to save her, right?)

DURING Adam's important life saving excursion of moseying to the kitchen for knives, grabbing and dragging a small table for easier cutting? LIFE SAVING MODE??? What a LIE! If you want to save someone's life you do not text and make phone calls! You GET TO IT!

Reminder: 1) Adam never rushes to the body to take the pressure off the noose. 2) Adam never loosens the noose after he cuts Rebecca down.

HinkySD, isn't this what you wrote? What did you mean? If Adam HAD sent Jonah a text before he called 911, THAT would've been HINKY! Maybe you can explain? And explain your thoughts about Adam and what role he played in Rebecca's death?

Hi again, ThirdEye!

I wanted to thank you for quoting my previous post. I enjoyed reading it and see where I left something out.

Why didn't that worthless POS Adam ever scream for 'HELP!'?

I remember a HM poster saying that if they would have walked into that courtyard and saw Rebecca hanging like that they would have run down the street yelling 'Murder! Murder! Murder!' I still remember that post and could not agree more.

Now I'm wondering about someone in 'life saving' mode. If you are an incompetent nincompoop, you surely know it. Why didn't tugboat Adam scream for 'Help!' in hopes that someone with two clean hands and a thought process would respond.

Because he called 911 like 99% of the population would do. That's what you are SUPPOSE to do.

If Adam is in life-saving mode, Rebecca is still saveable and is not dead.

WAAAAAIIIIITTTT! Adam believes that Rebecca is not dead, saveable, might be alive, gonna cut her down and save her.

After receiving Adam's text, Jonah calls Dina and tells her that Rebecca is dead, she committed suicide.

Do you get it? BEFORE calling 911 the word has been spread that Rebecca is d-e-a-d!

ThirdEye wrote:Because he called 911 like 99% of the population would do. That's what you are SUPPOSE to do.

I do not know what kind of backwoods you live in, but 99% of the population (that intended on saving a life) would STOP the strangulation!

ThirdEye wrote:Because he called 911 like 99% of the population would do. That's what you are SUPPOSE to do.

No, no, no! He was busy pressing his warm lips up against those of a person in FULL BLOWN RIGOR!
He was busy, as boat captain should be, trying to give AN UNGIVING CHEST compressions, right?

What a joke.

So tell me just how he positioned her head and jaw to give her mouth to mouth when we KNOW THE JAW WOULD NOT MOVE DUE TO RIGOR?

YOU explain, okay? As much as you ask US to explain our views, PLEASE, PLEASE answer our questions to YOU without redirecting, okay?

Let me try to blow some air down this rigid throat! Leave the noose and tee shirt in place although it appears to be constricting the air way! Don't put her flat on the ground for chest compressions.

A joke. Gotta be a joke.

Freckles wrote:

ThirdEye wrote:Because he called 911 like 99% of the population would do. That's what you are SUPPOSE to do.

No, no, no! He was busy pressing his warm lips up against those of a person in FULL BLOWN RIGOR!
He was busy, as boat captain should be, trying to give AN UNGIVING CHEST compressions, right?

What a joke.

So tell me just how he positioned her head and jaw to give her mouth to mouth when we KNOW THE JAW WOULD NOT MOVE DUE TO RIGOR?

YOU explain, okay? As much as you ask US to explain our views, PLEASE, PLEASE answer our questions to YOU without redirecting, okay?

Let me try to blow some air down this rigid throat! Leave the noose and tee shirt in place although it appears to be constricting the air way! Don't put her flat on the ground for chest compressions.

A joke. Gotta be a joke.

It is a JOKE, Freckles!

Let's not forget that Adam reported that he was masturbating (maybe to asian-bondage-anime porn) minutes before walking out the door........ and LO AND BEHOLD ....... ten feet away there's an asian, bound, gagged, hanged, degraded, humiliated, a beautiful real life woman.

HinkySD says"It is a JOKE, Freckles!

Let's not forget that Adam reported that
he was masturbating (maybe to asian-bondage-anime porn) minutes before
walking out the door........ and LO AND BEHOLD ....... ten feet away
there's an asian, bound, gagged, hanged, degraded, humiliated, a
beautiful real life woman."

And, besides Jessica says ADAM is CUTE! Wahoo!
And, besides JONAH is such a nice guy. He LOVED Rebecca!
(Neither of these comments are relevant to the situation. But these Jessica and ThirdEye THINK they explain EVERYTHING! Wow. The world is in trouble now. )

HinkySD,

Please remember the secretions found on the tee shirt. I am sure Adam was trying to cover his bases. Just in case, you know?

I remember the 911 call and hearing Adam yell at Rebecca: Are you alive?

Still, he did "not" "even" loosen the noose around her neck.

Words.

Freckles wrote:HinkySD,

Please remember the secretions found on the tee shirt. I am sure Adam was trying to cover his bases. Just in case, you know?

I remember the Autopsy Report noting secretions on the tee shirt and looked for any further notations that samples of the secretions had been taken and sent to the lab.

There were no such further notations; why not?

Puzzler wrote:I remember the 911 call and hearing Adam yell at Rebecca: Are you alive?

Still, he did "not" "even" loosen the noose around her neck.

Words.

So. Was Rebecca supposed to yell back, No, Adam. I am dead! I would tell you all about it but I got this shirt wrapped around my neck and twined with the noose.

So Adam, hearing Rebecca sound those unspoken words his way, raced over to ... Give the dead "girl" CPR but he forgot to remove the noose, the tee shirt, lay her upon the ground, unbind her hands, etc. Maybe, he thought there was a mitzvah (law) against doing these things?

Puzzler wrote:

Freckles wrote:HinkySD,

Please remember the secretions found on the tee shirt. I am sure Adam was trying to cover his bases. Just in case, you know?

I remember the Autopsy Report noting secretions on the tee shirt and looked for any further notations that samples of the secretions had been taken and sent to the lab.

There were no such further notations; why not?

Did they even send them? They are not too great about doing follow-up down there, I hear.
I don't believe the blood drops were tested either. The ones they said were collected?
Would AB know?

Wonder how DS is doing with the autopsy pics of MS?

Freckles wrote:

Puzzler wrote:

Freckles wrote:HinkySD,

Please remember the secretions found on the tee shirt. I am sure Adam was trying to cover his bases. Just in case, you know?

I remember the Autopsy Report noting secretions on the tee shirt and looked for any further notations that samples of the secretions had been taken and sent to the lab.

There were no such further notations; why not?

Did they even send them? They are not too great about doing follow-up down there, I hear.
I don't believe the blood drops were tested either. The ones they said were collected?
Would AB know?

Wonder how DS is doing with the autopsy pics of MS?

There was NO notation of a "sample" being taken of the secretions on the tee shirt; therefore, if samples weren't taken, then they couldn't have been sent to a lab.

Now, there were blood samples, but Sheriff Gore told us himself during a presser that they just can't test every blood sample.

Jessica2 wrote:@ThirdEye- You seem like such a genuinely nice person. I really appreciate reading your respectful posts.

Thank you Jessica2. I am always willing to have a civil conversation, even if I am not in agreement with what you have to say. ; )
You seem to have medical knowledge - I'm sure I'll have some questions for you about this case! Thanks again for your post.

Gore told us that not all of the blood samples were tested.

According to the Autopsy Report, there was blood on the bottom of RZ's big toe, but there was not notation that a sample of that blood was taken and sent to the lab for testing.

Has there been and verified data about what happened to the door with the writing on it?

Sure wish InParadise was here so she could give us the status on the Spreckles Mansion upgrade.

Jessica2 wrote:

Freckles wrote:

Jessica2 wrote:@Freckles- I did not want to put this out there, but Adam is a really
really nice guy. I think that whole family is super nice. I always think
like this, if someone talks to another person who likes you, that other
person will sing your praises. If they talk to someone who does not
like you, then they will speak negative about you. You don't know
anything about Adam's character, and he is nothing like what all of you
believe.The whole family is nothing like what you believe. Jonah LOVED
Rebecca. That is all I will say.

Again I ask, what does being a "nice person" have to do with this?

I disagree with the conclusion re speaking nicely/poorly about someone.
I don't rely on the relationships others have to form my own opinions of liking/not liking someone. And there is no need for me to "like" or "not like" any member of this saga. After all, I am not forming a relationship with any of them!

Based upon what you are saying, you sound like you have a personal relationship with someone of them. And you want me to "like" them because you do! Well, that would be your relationship, not mine. I don't know you from Adam so why would I care whether you want me to like specific people? Of course, if you like them, you want others to do the same. That is what you said, right?

Sorry. Liking someone has nothing to do with the murder and coverup of Rebecca. So you may like anyone you choose, okay? It does not follow I must trail behind your lead simply because you say so, right?

@Freckles-Respectfully, you don't know them, you are reading things in the tabloids, and forming an opinion based on that. It was in response to "looks have nothing to do with character" and comparing him to Ted Bundy. I don't expect you to like anyone, just stating my opinion like you state yours. I don't assume you are trying to change my mind, neither am I trying to change yours.

Does anyone recognize this quote?: I think it would be a good idea to stick to the facts.

"-What if the end result of the next step is the same? What if they still conclude suicide? Then what? Will you ever accept this if finally it ends up that this was the answer all along?
You guys think about it please. The Shacknai kids were accused, DS,JS,Nina and AS were accused, and indirectly or directly its still happening. Why not stick to the facts? Disprove the facts presented. At the end of the day it does not matter how you feel about the people involved. Personal opinion about people does not make it murder."

@willow123-I wrote that. So? My name is the same in both places so it it isn't like I am pretending to be someone else. I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to prove/disprove.

Puzzler wrote:

Freckles wrote:

Puzzler wrote:

Freckles wrote:HinkySD,

Please remember the secretions found on the tee shirt. I am sure Adam was trying to cover his bases. Just in case, you know?

I remember the Autopsy Report noting secretions on the tee shirt and looked for any further notations that samples of the secretions had been taken and sent to the lab.

There were no such further notations; why not?

Did they even send them? They are not too great about doing follow-up down there, I hear.
I don't believe the blood drops were tested either. The ones they said were collected?
Would AB know?

Wonder how DS is doing with the autopsy pics of MS?

There was NO notation of a "sample" being taken of the secretions on the tee shirt; therefore, if samples weren't taken, then they couldn't have been sent to a lab.

Now, there were blood samples, but Sheriff Gore told us himself during a presser that they just can't test every blood sample.

@Puzzler-I read that they took the t shirt. In hanging deaths, saliva does dribble out of the mouth. If the secretions on the t-shirt are Rebecca s saliva, there would be no point in testing it further.(My opinion.)

When I first learned about this story, I too thought Rebecca was murdered. However, I never thought it was anyone from the family that did it. I thought maybe a stranger knew that everyone would be at the hospital and they committed this "crime". Of course now, with the release of all of the reports my opinion is different.
I understand that people believe it was murder with everything in them, but I do question if not for some deep rooted anger and hatred for this family why no one has ever thought of anyone other than the family as having committed this "crime" you believe in.

ThirdEye wrote:

Jessica2 wrote:@ThirdEye- You seem like such a genuinely nice person. I really appreciate reading your respectful posts.

Thank you Jessica2. I am always willing to have a civil conversation, even if I am not in agreement with what you have to say. ; )
You seem to have medical knowledge - I'm sure I'll have some questions for you about this case! Thanks again for your post.

@ThirdEye- I have been trying to understand forever what the points may be that cause people to think it was murder. People think she was murdered-I get it, but I wanted to know what are the points that make them think that? I gave up because it was hard to decipher with the included free-for-all insults against the family. It's still the same now as it was then.
I am not trying to change anyone's mind. I just want to make and confirm a rational conclusion for myself taking into account where the basis of the murder theory comes from.
I do believe that Dina's investigation will provide some answers.
I am not against a reinvestigation into the death of Rebecca Zahau. Whatever the answers may be, it may bring some closure to the Zahau family, and clear the names of those who have been directly or indirectly accused.

Puzzler wrote:A few may believe a thin red line was left by a bulky T-shirt, but not I.

To each their own.

@Puzzler- I don't get the point about the thin red line either. If it was caused by "strangulation", it would not be a thin red line, it would be a deep furrow that would later turn deeper in color. Could she have worn a chain that she removed?
I don't think (my opinion) it was from the rope from the hanging, because alot of times in hanging death, the rope becomes untied or may shift in place according to the movement of the body during death(siezures etc.). Since there was a t-shirt tied above the rope, I don't think the rope caused it(the rope would be secure), but I could be wrong.
I'm thinking it was an incidental finding.

Willow123 wrote:
Does anyone recognize this quote?: I think it would be a good idea to stick to the facts.

"-What if the end result of the next step is the same? What if they still conclude suicide? Then what? Will you ever accept this if finally it ends up that this was the answer all along?

You guys think about it please. The Shacknai kids were accused, DS,JS,Nina and AS were accused, and indirectly or directly its still happening. Why not stick to the facts? Disprove the facts presented. At the end of the day it does not matter how you feel about the people involved. Personal opinion about people does not make it murder."

Willow- Thank you! I do remember this quote.

Everyone has been accused even Rebecca and Xena of causing harm to Max.

I have read the past few pages of this thread and so few posts have been about the facts. The rest have been aggressive assumptions, speculations, name calling and bloviating. I had to check my web address to make sure I wasn't at some left handed *bleep* website. This is not a healthy discussion. Every opinion matters, whether you believe Rebecca committed suicide or you believe she was murdered. I might disagree with a poster, but I don't dislike that person because of their opinion. I'm going to treat them with respect as long as they treat me with respect. If they don't, I will scroll and roll. Both sides can learn from each other if we listen and ask questions surrounded by facts. Neither side really knows what happened and we may never know. Especially if we continue to treat each others side like they have no value and should just be mute. Of course, just my opinion and NOT directed at any one person!

Jessica2 wrote:

Puzzler wrote:A few may believe a thin red line was left by a bulky T-shirt, but not I.

To each their own.

@Puzzler- I don't get the point about the thin red line either. If it was caused by "strangulation", it would not be a thin red line, it would be a deep furrow that would later turn deeper in color. Could she have worn a chain that she removed?
I don't think (my opinion) it was from the rope from the hanging, because alot of times in hanging death, the rope becomes untied or may shift in place according to the movement of the body during death(siezures etc.). Since there was a t-shirt tied above the rope, I don't think the rope caused it(the rope would be secure), but I could be wrong.
I'm thinking it was an incidental finding.

-- Now just how would she have removed the chain AFTER she was dead?
The tee and the noose were intertwined in places--- along with her hair.
The rope left its own distinct ligature mark as did the tee.

Please explain the "accidental finding".

Lash wrote:

Willow123 wrote:
Does anyone recognize this quote?: I think it would be a good idea to stick to the facts.

"-What if the end result of the next step is the same? What if they still conclude suicide? Then what? Will you ever accept this if finally it ends up that this was the answer all along?

You guys think about it please. The Shacknai kids were accused, DS,JS,Nina and AS were accused, and indirectly or directly its still happening. Why not stick to the facts? Disprove the facts presented. At the end of the day it does not matter how you feel about the people involved. Personal opinion about people does not make it murder."

Willow- Thank you! I do remember this quote.

Everyone has been accused even Rebecca and Xena of causing harm to Max.

I have read the past few pages of this thread and so few posts have been about the facts. The rest have been aggressive assumptions, speculations, name calling and bloviating. I had to check my web address to make sure I wasn't at some left handed *bleep* website. This is not a healthy discussion. Every opinion matters, whether you believe Rebecca committed suicide or you believe she was murdered. I might disagree with a poster, but I don't dislike that person because of their opinion. I'm going to treat them with respect as long as they treat me with respect. If they don't, I will scroll and roll. Both sides can learn from each other if we listen and ask questions surrounded by facts. Neither side really knows what happened and we may never know. Especially if we continue to treat each others side like they have no value and should just be mute. Of course, just my opinion and NOT directed at any one person!

@Lash- I wrote what you posted. I am not pretending to be someone else, my name is the same:) I completely agree with you that "both sides can learn from each other if we listen and ask questions surrounded by facts." That is honestly why I came here.