Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
As for Hyma, he defended his decision on the homicide and downplayed the 3-millimeter scar in Eleonora Kaufman’s heart discovered by a defense expert.
Hyma said the young woman’s heart was healthy, and the scar was a healing in a part of the organ that played no role in the woman’s death.
“She had the scar the day before. She had the scar the weeks before. She had the scar months before, most likely,” Hyma said. “She died with it, not because of it.”
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/21/2810831/miami-dade-chief-medical-examiner.html#storylink=cpy
Hyma said the young woman’s heart was healthy, and the scar was a healing in a part of the organ that played no role in the woman’s death.
“She had the scar the day before. She had the scar the weeks before. She had the scar months before, most likely,” Hyma said. “She died with it, not because of it.”
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/21/2810831/miami-dade-chief-medical-examiner.html#storylink=cpy
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state/aventura-victims-mother-takes-the-stand-for-the-2375299.html
-snipped for different places in the article-
An Aventura woman’s mother testified Thursday that she witnessed her daughter faint at least “10 to 12 times” in the years before she was found collapsed in the bathroom of her home in November 2007
But Aizman took the stand Monday to say that Eleonora Kaufman did indeed suffer from mysterious dizzy spells and “pressure in her chest.”
More than eight years before Kaufman’s death, Aizman said she had already witnessed the fainting spells about a dozen times. At least once, around 2004 when Aizman was living in Denmark, her daughter called to say she had fainted and couldn’t get up.
“I don’t feel my legs and I don’t know what happened,” she recalled Kaufman saying.
-snipped for different places in the article-
An Aventura woman’s mother testified Thursday that she witnessed her daughter faint at least “10 to 12 times” in the years before she was found collapsed in the bathroom of her home in November 2007
But Aizman took the stand Monday to say that Eleonora Kaufman did indeed suffer from mysterious dizzy spells and “pressure in her chest.”
More than eight years before Kaufman’s death, Aizman said she had already witnessed the fainting spells about a dozen times. At least once, around 2004 when Aizman was living in Denmark, her daughter called to say she had fainted and couldn’t get up.
“I don’t feel my legs and I don’t know what happened,” she recalled Kaufman saying.
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/15/2801110/medical-evidence-introduced-in.html
-snipped-
Using autopsy photos, Gwin chronicled a litany of injuries to the woman, including bruises and abrasions on her neck, shoulder, elbow, knee and chin, as well as burst blood vessels in her eyes consistent with strangulation. She also had injuries deep inside her throat that only could have come from “significant” pressure to her neck, Gwin told prosecutor Joseph Mansfield.
Her heart was normal and showed no signs of an attack, Gwin said.
On cross examination, defense lawyer Al Milian tried to poke holes in Gwin’s credentials, pointing out that he was a forensic pathologist in training at the time and his investigation failed to find a tiny scar in her heart later uncovered by a defense expert. Milian suggested that burst blood vessels in her eyes could have come from the strain of a heart attack brought on by “severe constipation.”
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/15/2801110/medical-evidence-introduced-in.html#storylink=cpy
-snipped-
Using autopsy photos, Gwin chronicled a litany of injuries to the woman, including bruises and abrasions on her neck, shoulder, elbow, knee and chin, as well as burst blood vessels in her eyes consistent with strangulation. She also had injuries deep inside her throat that only could have come from “significant” pressure to her neck, Gwin told prosecutor Joseph Mansfield.
Her heart was normal and showed no signs of an attack, Gwin said.
On cross examination, defense lawyer Al Milian tried to poke holes in Gwin’s credentials, pointing out that he was a forensic pathologist in training at the time and his investigation failed to find a tiny scar in her heart later uncovered by a defense expert. Milian suggested that burst blood vessels in her eyes could have come from the strain of a heart attack brought on by “severe constipation.”
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/15/2801110/medical-evidence-introduced-in.html#storylink=cpy
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/cvplive/cvpstream2#/video/cvplive/cvpstream2
This will be on shortly.
This will be on shortly.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I don't think this investigator has improved with age. He is still less than impressive.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I think he is holding his own with the pros
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I am pretty surprised at how often the judge blatantly sides with the prosecution. She overrules the defense almost without listening to the objection.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Yeah I noticed that too...I don't think he could have pulled his car in around her SUV
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I agree. This whole thing with the heat of the car is pointing out just what LE didn't do. If they were going to make a point of this, I would think they would have something to back it up. I am liking how Mr. Hill matches the sarcasm of the pros. He finally just says, that's what I think. Then what else can Pros. say? This is better than he started off with today.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
lol...different between chipped nails and chipped nail polish. My nail polish is chipped all the time on my right hand!
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I think the signs of a struggle or lack thereof in the bathroom is significant.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I wish I lived closer to this trial, I would go. There isn't anybody in there except a few behind Adam.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
This is about the weirdest case ever.
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
why would the Defense want a re-trial? imo, they have done a pretty good job., if, a retrial, they have to try the case again.
Statistics show most are convicted the 2nd time around.
Statistics show most are convicted the 2nd time around.
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Dr. Marachini.....board certified forensic pathologist...among other things. Certified to testify in numerous areas across country and also Federally.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Art Tart, I think they know the judge will deny, but they are preserving the record for appeal if necessary
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
tesstruhart wrote:Art Tart, I think they know the judge will deny, but they are preserving the record for appeal if necessary
tesstruhart, I think you are right.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I wonder if this would have shown up in a cardiogram. If so, why didn't the other dr. from plastic surgery see it?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Also, I wonder if he will explain the bruising on her neck.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I think he is a very good teacher and makes things understandable.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
KZ,
Dr. Marraccini made his own slides of heart tissue that he knows to be "trouble spots" found "scar" on heart. Postage stamp size of heart taken...."step" section of heart...200 slides made.
He found scar to be 10mm in size (typing as he is talking, excuse punctuation)
Middle of heart, high septal region, supposed to be purple, is pinkish grey. Size is head of thumbtack, not head of pin. Seen without microscope, 3/8 inch, 10mm.
Under microscope scar tissue shows substantial heart disease. Many months old. Damage is in the septum dividing ventricles.
Damn phone call...lol
Dr. Marraccini made his own slides of heart tissue that he knows to be "trouble spots" found "scar" on heart. Postage stamp size of heart taken...."step" section of heart...200 slides made.
He found scar to be 10mm in size (typing as he is talking, excuse punctuation)
Middle of heart, high septal region, supposed to be purple, is pinkish grey. Size is head of thumbtack, not head of pin. Seen without microscope, 3/8 inch, 10mm.
Under microscope scar tissue shows substantial heart disease. Many months old. Damage is in the septum dividing ventricles.
Damn phone call...lol
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Can someone take over on the testimony of Dr. M, I am still on the phone
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Chickenbutt, I had to take an adderall, I have ADHD, my eyes are glazing over & I'm distracted. LOL!
If Lina had "mayocarditis (sp), why didn't other's find it?
I guess this is going to come down to: which expert do you believe.
If Lina had "mayocarditis (sp), why didn't other's find it?
I guess this is going to come down to: which expert do you believe.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
imo, this professional is saying that the COD (cause of death) came down to "process of illimination," the jury may think this is plausible since it took 18 months to get a COD from Dr. Hyma.
imo, this witness is a lot better than Dr. Hyma in that he is explaining to the jury, he is talking to the jury, he seems more passionate about his testimony. Does it make it correct? IDK, am I getting confused? yes~!
Is that the point of his testimony? probably!
imo, this witness is a lot better than Dr. Hyma in that he is explaining to the jury, he is talking to the jury, he seems more passionate about his testimony. Does it make it correct? IDK, am I getting confused? yes~!
Is that the point of his testimony? probably!
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Still on the phone...long winded friend
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Witness says marks on necck could be caused by alot of things.First thing he says is ameteur cpr by husband.
Didn't Adam say she had marks on her neck in his 911 call?
Didn't Adam say she had marks on her neck in his 911 call?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Arrthymia, postural asphyxia...collapsed onto object causing neck compression...
Here comes the injuries explaination...injurys do not indicate homocide...indicates a need to find out what could have caused these injuries. From amateur trying to do CPR, failed attempts of fire rescue, moving victim etc. No ligature marks. Abrasions
Adam averts his eyes...I think he is upset.
Pressure marks present...(not showing on TV) consistent with her left arm coming in contact with magazine rack
a number of marks present could be from grabbing of emt for resciitation.
Here comes the injuries explaination...injurys do not indicate homocide...indicates a need to find out what could have caused these injuries. From amateur trying to do CPR, failed attempts of fire rescue, moving victim etc. No ligature marks. Abrasions
Adam averts his eyes...I think he is upset.
Pressure marks present...(not showing on TV) consistent with her left arm coming in contact with magazine rack
a number of marks present could be from grabbing of emt for resciitation.
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
suz, glad you joined us this morning. I do think Adam mentioned the marks on the neck on the 911 calls.
tesstruhart, 3 point match? Seems plausible.
It is going to be interestng to see how well the State does on cross on this witness. Thus far, I have been underwhelmed w/the big guy, the female Prosecutor imo, has a better delivery.
tesstruhart, 3 point match? Seems plausible.
It is going to be interestng to see how well the State does on cross on this witness. Thus far, I have been underwhelmed w/the big guy, the female Prosecutor imo, has a better delivery.
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Holy cow....talk, talk, talk....I am off the phone finally.
Will go back to watching now.
Petchiae consistent with sudden cardiac event per Dr. M
Hemorrages to inside her neck.. consistent with face and neck down, ER, EMS attempts to resusitate. Hyoid bone intact.
Thyroid cartilage has horns they are intact. Negative finding does not support homicide.
Will go back to watching now.
Petchiae consistent with sudden cardiac event per Dr. M
Hemorrages to inside her neck.. consistent with face and neck down, ER, EMS attempts to resusitate. Hyoid bone intact.
Thyroid cartilage has horns they are intact. Negative finding does not support homicide.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
which 2 bones were not broken in the neck? I left the room.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Scattered hemorrages on neck in strap muscles. Hemorrages in thyroid tissue, talking about intubation, cric pressure, moving head around to intubate. Hemo adjacent to structure around voicebox structure, consistent with difficult intubation...hitting the sides. Deep strap muscles, hemo due to traction and manipulation.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Dr. now explaining how he made measurements from objects in magazine rack to marks on body.
Results are that he can make a 3 point match to magazine rack and magazines. chin, shoulder and left arm.
Says big controversy over her ever being on magazine rack, he says its a match that she was on magazine rack.
He says all marks are consistent with Lina falling on magazine rack, husband doing cpr, emt doing cpr, transport to hospital.
what is petechiae....tiny red marks around or in the eye. Can be caused by sudden cardiac death or asphyxia. Her petechiae is consistent with sudden cardiac event.
hemmorages on internal of neck...consistent with a combination of things..face and neck down on magazine rack, panicked husband doing cpr, rescue doing cpr, face down gravity. Hyoid not fractured, thyroid cartilage has 2 horns that protrude. In homocidal asphyxia the horn is fractured. Not so in this case.
Scattered hemmoraghes in strap muscles, consistent with medical intervention. Failed resusataation, failed intubation manipulating neck to help to get tube down.
Back of voicebox structure with hemmorhage, consistent with failed intubaation attempt.
If you lay a dead body face down, you can create artifacts that weren't there before. (sorry, I don't what artifacts he was talking about)
Results are that he can make a 3 point match to magazine rack and magazines. chin, shoulder and left arm.
Says big controversy over her ever being on magazine rack, he says its a match that she was on magazine rack.
He says all marks are consistent with Lina falling on magazine rack, husband doing cpr, emt doing cpr, transport to hospital.
what is petechiae....tiny red marks around or in the eye. Can be caused by sudden cardiac death or asphyxia. Her petechiae is consistent with sudden cardiac event.
hemmorages on internal of neck...consistent with a combination of things..face and neck down on magazine rack, panicked husband doing cpr, rescue doing cpr, face down gravity. Hyoid not fractured, thyroid cartilage has 2 horns that protrude. In homocidal asphyxia the horn is fractured. Not so in this case.
Scattered hemmoraghes in strap muscles, consistent with medical intervention. Failed resusataation, failed intubation manipulating neck to help to get tube down.
Back of voicebox structure with hemmorhage, consistent with failed intubaation attempt.
If you lay a dead body face down, you can create artifacts that weren't there before. (sorry, I don't what artifacts he was talking about)
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Myocarditis and AV block
Chickenbutt wrote:KZ,
Dr. Marraccini made his own slides of heart tissue that he knows to be "trouble spots" found "scar" on heart. Postage stamp size of heart taken...."step" section of heart...200 slides made.
He found scar to be 10mm in size (typing as he is talking, excuse punctuation)
Middle of heart, high septal region, supposed to be purple, is pinkish grey. Size is head of thumbtack, not head of pin. Seen without microscope, 3/8 inch, 10mm.
Under microscope scar tissue shows substantial heart disease. Many months old. Damage is in the septum dividing ventricles.
Damn phone call...lol
Just popping in on a break. Sounds like what he is theorizing may have happened is complete AV conduction block secondary to vegetative myocarditis creating an area of "dead" myocardium in the septum.
Here are a few references:
http://www.cvphysiology.com/Arrhythmias/A003.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purkinje_fibers
http://www.mendeley.com/research/complete-atrioventricular-block-associated-with-regional-myocardial-scarring-in-a-patient-with-coxsackie-b2-myocarditis/
"Transient atrioventricular (A-V) conduction abnormalities are often experienced in patients with evolving acute viral myocarditis, but persistent complete A-V block requiring permanent cardiac pacing is rare."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4382880
http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Fiedler's+myocarditis
Myocarditis is an inflammatory disease of the heart muscle (myocardium) that can result from a variety of causes. While most cases are produced by a viral infection, an inflammation of the heart muscle may also be instigated by toxins, drugs, and hypersensitive immune reactions. Myocarditis is a rare but serious condition that affects both males and females of any age.
Description
Most cases of myocarditis in the United States originate from a virus, and the disease may remain undiagnosed by doctors due to its general lack of initial symptoms. The disease may also present itself as an acute, catastrophic illness that requires immediate treatment. Although the inflammation or degeneration of the heart muscle that myocarditis causes may be fatal, this disease often goes undetected. It may also disguise itself as ischemic, valvular, or hypertensive heart disease.
It's all interesting, and this expert may be more well-spoken than the other prosecution witness, but I still think it's a monumental stretch to say that with such a localized area of disease that a sudden complete heart block could have occurred, causing her to pass out and create the secondary damage to her neck (and other scratches, etc) we have heard about. Or sudden heart failure with flash pulmonary edema, and pink froth splashing onto walls. I don't buy it. She may have had a previous myocarditis (can happen after a common URI), but I have very sincere doubts that it initiated the damage pattern in her neck in that bathroom. Hopefully, the prosecution can counter that in re-cross with their expert.
She may have had sudden onset heart block secondary to strangling, also. Chicken and egg.
This is an odd case-- I don't think she died of natural causes, and I think someone strangled her, but I'm not convinced it was her husband. And there were some pretty glaring problems with the police investigation and duration of autopsy findings that will inevitably introduce some procedural doubt for the jurors. Will be interesting to see what the jury thinks.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Arrythmia caused by scarring....fell...
Sudden electrical occurance causing her to go down
In bathroom, common place for retreating when feeling ill
Cause of death....heart disease and postural asphyxia.
Sudden electrical occurance causing her to go down
In bathroom, common place for retreating when feeling ill
Cause of death....heart disease and postural asphyxia.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Pulmonary edema was present. Lungs were "heavy". Not an asphixial homicide. Not mechanical asphixial homicide.
Heart disease, fall, asphxia due to contact with object on ground....his dx
Court to lunch
Heart disease, fall, asphxia due to contact with object on ground....his dx
Court to lunch
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Mouse just dropped dead, so I had to get a new battery
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Whew...thanks everyone for picking up where I left off...lots to digest
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Wow-- interesting stuff-- wet heavy lungs would not be a result of "complete" strangling, but straining against a closed glottis is another thing that CAN produce flash pulmonary edema. Negative pressure pulmonary edema. We worry about it in the OR and PACU. I've seen it twice.
http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-anesthesiology/volume-12-number-1/management-of-unpred-cted-postoperat-ve-negat-ve-pressure-pulmonary-edema-a-report-of-two-cases.html
http://www.saudija.org/article.asp?issn=1658-354X;year=2011;volume=5;issue=3;spage=308;epage=313;aulast=Bhaskar
"Other factors that increase the risk of Type I NPPE are hanging, strangulation, upper airway tumors, foreign bodies, epiglottitis, croup, chocking, migration of Folly's catheter balloon used to tamponade the nose in epistaxis, near drowning, endotracheal tube (ETT) obstruction, goitre, and mononucleosis."
http://journals.lww.com/anesthesiology/Fulltext/2011/02000/Acute_Postoperative_Negative_pressure_Pulmonary.42.aspx
Thanks for the play by play, tess and CB. I have to go, but will check back later. Interested to hear the end.
edited to add quote above about strangulation. KZ
http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-anesthesiology/volume-12-number-1/management-of-unpred-cted-postoperat-ve-negat-ve-pressure-pulmonary-edema-a-report-of-two-cases.html
http://www.saudija.org/article.asp?issn=1658-354X;year=2011;volume=5;issue=3;spage=308;epage=313;aulast=Bhaskar
"Other factors that increase the risk of Type I NPPE are hanging, strangulation, upper airway tumors, foreign bodies, epiglottitis, croup, chocking, migration of Folly's catheter balloon used to tamponade the nose in epistaxis, near drowning, endotracheal tube (ETT) obstruction, goitre, and mononucleosis."
http://journals.lww.com/anesthesiology/Fulltext/2011/02000/Acute_Postoperative_Negative_pressure_Pulmonary.42.aspx
Thanks for the play by play, tess and CB. I have to go, but will check back later. Interested to hear the end.
edited to add quote above about strangulation. KZ
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
KZ,
Glad to see you are checking in...this is all very interesting. Such divergent opinions from the professionals. Who ever said science was boring?
Glad to see you are checking in...this is all very interesting. Such divergent opinions from the professionals. Who ever said science was boring?
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
IN Session analyst suggested State needs to GET IN & GET OUT in crosss. (good idea as this guy is so articulate, explained in laymans terms to the jury, that, imo, means a lot)
She also states the State make point:
"Dr. M didn't do autopsy," but DUH! neither did Dr. Hyma.
She also states the State make point:
"Dr. M didn't do autopsy," but DUH! neither did Dr. Hyma.
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Do we know the jury makeup? I wonder f there are any health care professinals on the jury.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Art...I think Dr. M did a very good job explaining in laymen's terms what he thinks happened.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Vinnie on insessions just brought up the fact that the defendent himself said in his 911 call that there were marks on her neck.Thank you Vinnie! I still say that magazine rack did not cause that deep tissue damage
Last edited by suz1729 on Tue May 29, 2012 1:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Location : Lakeland, Florida
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Chickenbutt wrote:Art...I think Dr. M did a very good job explaining in laymen's terms what he thinks happened.
Chickenbutt, I am so impressed, I just didn't like Dr. Hyma because he acted BOTHERED imo. He ddn't even examine the magaxine rack, Dr. M. takes it to his office & matches 3 point to it.
I really apprciated Dr. M's delievery, passionate, PLUS he too was a former ME!
IN Sesson calling it a HOMe RUN1
Alternate possibility: I buy it! Really interesting.
wheres the rest of our online jury: Stark, Chester, Suzy! KZ is checking in!
Is the STATE going to screw up the Cross?
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
The size of the scarring is sizable: 10 MM NOT the 3MM the State claims!
Last edited by art tart on Tue May 29, 2012 1:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I am now more convinced that Adam didn't do this. I don't think she was murdered at all.
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
Join date : 2012-05-11
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
KZ, I don't know if you heard it or not but the scarring in the heart was in the septum and was 10mm. Does that change anything for you?
tesstruhart- Posts : 1682
Join date : 2011-07-02
Location : this side of heaven
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Chickenbutt wrote:I am now more convinced that Adam didn't do this. I don't think she was murdered at all.
I second the emotion CB! At the least, he has created reasonable doubt. Unless there is a cardiologist on the jury, the STATE is probably sunk!
Guest- Guest
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
I like the 3 points of pressure matched up with magazines and neck.
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
Join date : 2012-05-11
Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL)
Sure wish I knew what the staining was on the magazines. Was it tan solution? Was it pulmonary edema fluid? We'll never know since it wasn't tested.
Chickenbutt- Posts : 1509
Join date : 2012-05-11
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