Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12

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Google states about 47 miles from Morgan Hill to Pleasanton with an estimated driving time in current traffic as 1 hour 11 minutes.

Thats quite a little drive.

http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/police-discover-dead-body-pleasanton/nPDdq/
Pleasanton police discover human remains in garbage can alongside road

Pleasanton police discovered human remains stuffed inside a 45-gallon trashcan alongside a rural road late Thursday morning.

http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton

The caption under the picture in this article says the body was found "in this trash can". There is no trash can that I can see, but the body is on a gurney.

I can't understand everything being said, but here is a "raw" video of the hearing today:

http://www.ktvu.com/videos/news/raw-video-sierra-lamar-murder-suspect-makes-first/vHRyP/

Doesn't sound like it could be Sierra with the fact that it appears it has only been there a few days. And if Torres has been being watched I would think it would be hard for him to go and retrieve the body and then drive around with a trash can in his vehicle without notice..Just sayin.

SweetT, I tend to think that way too. After reading other articles that stated it was beside a rural road, I could not believe the killer would just dump the body along side a road in plain sight.

Although I want her to be alive somewhere, it does not appear that likely.

Well technically it was not in plain site, it was in a trash can..so if they had it in a bag first then the trash can maybe, but with him being watched 24/7 I find it highly unlikely he could make that trip without notice and have a trash can in his vehicle too.

SweetT wrote:Well technically it was not in plain site, it was in a trash can..so if they had it in a bag first then the trash can maybe, but with him being watched 24/7 I find it highly unlikely he could make that trip without notice and have a trash can in his vehicle too.

If he is guilty than I doubt that's Sierra,
From a behavioral stand point.

http://www.kionrightnow.com/story/18620292/sheriffs-deputies-define-areas-to-search-for-sierra-lamars-body
Sheriff's Deputies Define Areas to Search for Sierra Lamar's Body
more at link

The areas of focus should be south Santa Clara County and the land bordering our county such as north San Benito County, north Monterey County and east Santa Cruz County.

nanaof4 wrote:http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton

The caption under the picture in this article says the body was found "in this trash can". There is no trash can that I can see, but the body is on a gurney.

When I clicked on your link in this post, there is a picture of a trash can lying on it's front side, as the wheels are visible on the bottom. That is a very large can like we have here, and I don't know what kind of car he has, but my trash can will not fit in my trunk with the door closed.

http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton

There are 10 photos here to this linked article. One or two show the size of the body bundle strapped onto the gurney. It appears to be a large person in that white bag. I don't see how this could be Sierra's size even before all this time has gone by to reduce her in size. Also, as
SweetT said, the trash can has not been noticed until recently which doesn't fit the time line if the suspect is the correct man in custody. That looks like a brand new trash can to me in the photo... not like one exposed to the elements for all this time. (Although I have no idea what "elements" are like out there in CA. and it certainly has a reputation, earned or not, for being dry.) Still, I think this is another victim of foul play rather than Sierra.

SweetT wrote:

SuperMom wrote:

SweetT wrote:Stolat: Yes and someone had better have a few hours on their hands to get their and drive back...unless they stayed in Yosemite for a few days first.

If I were leaving Morgan Hill to go to Yosemite, I would NOT head up 101 towards Fremont. I would take the 152 fwy, it would be a shorter, although windier, route.

JMO

Thanks Supermom, I didn't know that as I don't live anywhere near there. But good to know.

Yosemite is not an unpopulated place, its packed, now both 120 and 140 have very remote locations, with lakes and tons of dirt rds on public lands.

So is it possible that LE saw Torres or knew he bought a trash can, therefore they expected he was going to abduct etc again since maybe they figured out he didnt take it home and that is why they went ahead and arrested him? Which would mean they were watching him but not every second enough to know what he did with it?

Update from the #FINDSIERRA SMS Short Code (30304)

FINDSIERRA> Search 5/26 CANCELLED. Volunteers needed : Wed 5/30 & Sat 6/2 8-1pm 85 Tilton http://sgrid.me/fr

SweetT wrote:So is it possible that LE saw Torres or knew he bought a trash can, therefore they expected he was going to abduct etc again since maybe they figured out he didnt take it home and that is why they went ahead and arrested him? Which would mean they were watching him but not every second enough to know what he did with it?

The evidence really speaks of an organized offender.
They do hide/conceal their victims, but it could rarely be seen as dumping.

It does not add up in my mind, at least in terms of the dynamics of a sexual homicide, which is what I believe Smith wants us to infer when she says 'stranger abduction' and the fact that Sierra's clothes were left behind.

If he did it she is buried in a shallow grave or submerged.

Herhold: Sierra LaMar case resonates with many


BBM
While the LaMar family has to come to grips with tragedy, the family of Garcia Torres has to deal with public shunning. His sisters have talked about the Antolin they knew -- the good son who tried to hold the family together in tough straits.

It had to be against steep odds. Garcia Torres' father is in jail now, suspected of sexually assaulting a relative. An older brother, Benancio, was in and out of jail before dying of alcoholism. Antolin himself has a record for obstructing officers, vandalism and punching a relative.
That's why the broader community -- the third family of this story -- seemed ready Thursday to buy the DNA evidence, which was cautiously described as a "strong association" by District Attorney Jeff Rosen.


For the three families, this won't end with his arrest or even a trial. Everyone wants the whole story -- not just the who but the why and the how. A story that ends with a period, not a question mark.


http://www.mercurynews.com/scott-herhold/ci_20705078/herhold-sierra-lamar-case-resonates-many

Sierra LaMar's alleged killer charged with murder; no plea entered, no bail set

Nolan said it's become more difficult to make the case that the alleged victim is still alive in the absence of cellphone, credit card or texting activity, as in Sierra's case.
"The way our society has changed and the social media and technology, it's more and more difficult to disappear," Nolan said. "Technology now does play into these cases significantly."

The statement of facts filed by the sheriff's department in Sierra's case notes that Sierra frequented various social media sites -- until the morning she disappeared. Since then, no one has "seen, spoken with or communicated in any fashion" with her. She has no independent means of support, and all her personal belongs, including her asthma inhaler, money, house keys and clothing she was wearing when she disappeared have been found.


http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-courts/ci_20703042/sierra-lamar-alleged-killer-charged-murder-antolin-garcia-torres?source=rss

http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/crime-law/accused-sierra-lamar-slayer-makes-court-appearance/nPDY9/

Hope he did not get his law degree in FL....

District Attorney Jeff Rosen said after the hearing that Garcia-Torres is eligible for the death penalty, but that his office hasn't yet decided whether to pursue capital punishment.

Sierra's body has yet to be found and there's no murder weapon. Yet the district attorney's office says it has enough evidence to go to trial.

"A good defense attorney is going to want to get this to trial quickly," said Michael Cardoza,a criminal defense lawyer.

Cardoza added if her body isn't found and Garcia-Torres is acquitted, prosecutors may not be able to try him again.
"They cannot retry him if they find the body in a year or so and there's evidence on that body that shows that he did it. The game's over," explained Cardoza.

The books and the shoes to me would be the strongest physical indicators (besides her body) as to being surprised, attacked, removed by someone on a rural road in rainy weather.

In trying to gain control over Sierra, subdue her, and get her into the vehicle, both of those items would have to have gotten dirty. The books would have had to have fallen unless she was under gun point and stashing them herself. Yet that makes no sense- her bag contained her clothing worn by her, allegedly.

The fact that her shoes are still unaccounted for (despite her other personal items now being detailed) and her things were stashed, not thrown, are details of the crime that continue to raise a lot of questions for me.

Does anyone want to meet me at Paquita Espana for a re-enactment?

I am thinking maybe he did not have to subdue Sierra, she could have got in his car willingly. As LE reporting not finding a murder weapon, he could have strangled her or ditched the weapon. I would bet in most cases weapons are not found. I have to catch up, so if this was mentioned, sorry.

Ask hosteno she is right there

Tbrownsanjo wrote:Ask hosteno she is right there

good idea.

SuperMom wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:from the PDF file:

-traced Sierra's scent form her house to a point approximately mid-way down her street (that's new!)

-all of her known belongings, including her asthma inhaler, her money, her house keys, and the clothing she was wearing...have been located. (trying to prove she is not a runaway)

Red shoes??????

Yes, still nothing about the Red Converse she always wore......?????

The red converse shoes were used as a scent item as pictured earlier in the case. The alleged missing shoes are gray of an unknown size, brand and type.

As a side note, I am told using shoes is unusual as a scent item as they have many confusing scents involved for the dog.
The usual items are sheets, pillowcase or recently worn clothing because it is particular to the subjects scent alone.

O/T

Even if the body found is not Sierra, I found it very concerning that a body in a state of decomposition was removed separately from the can on the side of, or middle of the road without having been forensically examined. There it is just laid out on the highway
contacting a new surface.

Wouldn't you think they would have lifted the can intact and removed it "as is" to the coroner's office?

The body looked a bit larger then the can. How long does rigor mortis last?

Thanks for any responses.

http://www.localwireless.com/wap/news/text.jsp?sid=242&nid=1419700832


Update on body found

http://www.dundee.ac.uk/forensicmedicine/notes/water.pdf

Sorry the above is about water deaths - swollen body maybe that's why body looked big on gurney

Typo Positive wrote:O/T

Even if the body found is not Sierra, I found it very concerning that a body in a state of decomposition was removed separately from the can on the side of, or middle of the road without having been forensically examined. There it is just laid out on the highway
contacting a new surface.

Wouldn't you think they would have lifted the can intact and removed it "as is" to the coroner's office?

The body looked a bit larger then the can. How long does rigor mortis last?

Thanks for any responses.

I would think that the ME would have been called there or the entire can removed.
I mean the location if the dead body would be a crime scene.

Typo Positive wrote:

SuperMom wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:from the PDF file:

-traced Sierra's scent form her house to a point approximately mid-way down her street (that's new!)

-all of her known belongings, including her asthma inhaler, her money, her house keys, and the clothing she was wearing...have been located. (trying to prove she is not a runaway)

Red shoes??????

Yes, still nothing about the Red Converse she always wore......?????

The red converse shoes were used as a scent item as pictured earlier in the case. The alleged missing shoes are gray of an unknown size, brand and type.

As a side note, I am told using shoes is unusual as a scent item as they have many confusing scents involved for the dog.
The usual items are sheets, pillowcase or recently worn clothing because it is particular to the subjects scent alone.

I never knew that they had used the shoes for scent.

Tbrownsanjo wrote:Sorry the above is about water deaths - swollen body maybe that's why body looked big on gurney

Yes, it looked pretty big to have come out of that pristine container left in the middle of the hwy. to collect contamination.

Honeysage wrote:http://www.kionrightnow.com/story/18618965/courts-paperwork-details-sierras-last-day-before-she-was
Courts Paperwork Details Sierra's Life The Day She Was Kidnapped

However we did learn some new details in the case. The District Attorney's office released a timeline of events that happened on the morning Sierra disappeared.

PDF file http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kion/statement_of_fact.pdf

ETA: i don't know how to copy-paste PDF file or i would bring it all over for viewing.

The make up referred to in the text is not listed here among her personal effects.

The surveillance tapes placing him in the vicinity of her bus stop and evidence that day.

No mention of Torres alleged alibi.

Also there is nothing mentioned in the way of evidence that Sierra is deceased.

I do not see how they reached the probable cause of murder.

I do not see very much in this document.

Hinky's Mimi wrote:http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton

There are 10 photos here to this linked article. One or two show the size of the body bundle strapped onto the gurney. It appears to be a large person in that white bag. I don't see how this could be Sierra's size even before all this time has gone by to reduce her in size. Also, as
SweetT said, the trash can has not been noticed until recently which doesn't fit the time line if the suspect is the correct man in custody. That looks like a brand new trash can to me in the photo... not like one exposed to the elements for all this time. (Although I have no idea what "elements" are like out there in CA. and it certainly has a reputation, earned or not, for being dry.) Still, I think this is another victim of foul play rather than Sierra.

I don't want any more victims. Yet, I keep hoping Sierra will be found and she will be alive. I know it probably isn't there but I do keep hoping.

senseigurl wrote:If he were going to Fremont in the morning hours...it would take more than an hour to get there with all that traffic.

Do we know when he left the home that morning, if he reported to work or was assigned to report and failed to show?

I wonder if they could take any forensics off the tires or is that too much CSI???

http://www.localwireless.com/wap/news/text.jsp?sid=242&nid=1419700832
-- Prints were taken so decomp on fingers not there at this time


http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/police-discover-dead-body-pleasanton/nPDdq/
clipped--
" A source said it's very unlikely that it's the Morgan Hill teenager.

"We don't yet know the age or ethnicity or anything else, but we're hoping to learn that very soon," Bretzing added.

An autopsy was set for Friday, and investigators have already found a fingerprint, so they should be able to determine who the victim was.

"We're hoping that we can get ID very quickly after the autopsy tomorrow," Bretsinger said. "



http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
"The age and gender of the body have not yet been positively determined by the Alameda County Coroner's Office, and police offered no immediate details. But sources said late Thursday that the body, which has long hair and painted nails, likely is female. However, based on decomposition and age, authorities don't believe it is missing Morgan Hill 15-year-old Sierra Lamar. "

http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton

-- 4 pics referred to by other posters

i read somewhere that he left his home about 6:50am. it's probably a 5-minute drive to sierra's home. 20+ minutes transpired. he may have been driving around for a while in that area then stopped when the opportunity was right.

apparently he was off work that day. i don't know if you guys have had access to the facebook post with the argument going on between the girlfriend and pretty much the rest of Morgan Hill. too many contradictions as it is with her statements and some others.

sensei--
Do any of his relatives have a truck that could be used for transport?

Any possibility he drove with Sierra in the trunk of the red car until he could "safely" remove her?

Authorities have stated the can is not like what the community has seen or used for trash p/u. I wonder what day of the week trash is collected in that area?

While I don't think this is Sierra from the comments made in the articles, I have to ask.

senseigurl wrote:i read somewhere that he left his home about 6:50am. it's probably a 5-minute drive to sierra's home. 20+ minutes transpired. he may have been driving around for a while in that area then stopped when the opportunity was right.

apparently he was off work that day. i don't know if you guys have had access to the facebook post with the argument going on between the girlfriend and pretty much the rest of Morgan Hill. too many contradictions as it is with her statements and some others.

Where is he or a family member quoted about his activities and time specifics of that morning?

yes, some statements were made. i will PM you tamta.

senseigurl wrote:yes, some statements were made. i will PM you tamta.

Great.

Staring at murder; Garcia Torres officially charged


While Sierra’s body nor any other evidence proving she is dead has been recovered, authorities think she was murdered based on her lack of contact with any of her family or friends since she disappeared.


http://www.gilroydispatch.com/news/crime_fire_courts/search_for_sierra/staring-at-murder-garcia-torres-officially-charged/article_18ce4746-4bd6-561f-aa67-49fc7c6c9925.html

Sierra Lamar kidnapping suspect: I was fishing



Garcia-Torres told his mother that he could not be Sierra's kidnapper because he was busy fishing at the Uvas Creek in Morgan Hill on March 16.

Witnesses told investigators that they saw Garcia-Torres' Jetta driving around Sierra's neighborhood the morning she vanished.



Read more: http://www.ksbw.com/news/central-california/hollister-gilroy/Sierra-Lamar-kidnapping-suspect-I-was-fishing/-/5738758/14154804/-/3v7isn/-/index.html#ixzz1vt2cxv9z

http://www.ksbw.com/news/central-california/hollister-gilroy/Sierra-Lamar-kidnapping-suspect-I-was-fishing/-/5738758/14154804/-/item/0/-/taxln5/-/index.html

Sierra LaMar suspect being investigated for three 2009 Morgan Hill assaults


Morgan Hill police on Wednesday said they are looking into the possibility Garcia-Torres was involved in all three.

"The fact three of these happened in 2009 in such a short period of time, we're investigating and trying to see if he's responsible for all three," Morgan Hill police Sgt. Troy Hoefling said.

"Very seldom do cases happen in such
proximity (that) they are not related. But obviously we need to prove that."


More:

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20692280/sierra-lamar-suspect-being-investigated-three-2009-morgan

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
Body found in Pleasanton

PLEASANTON -- A body was discovered Thursday near Dublin Canyon Road and Laurel Creek drive, police said.
Representatives from the Alameda County Coroner's office loaded a gurney containing the body, in white bag, into a van and drove away from the area about 3 p.m., police said.

That looks closer to Freemont than to Morgan Hill.

How interesting....

more interesting when you look at it relative to Morgan Hill -- straight shot up north using Hwy 680 all the way. Just a 45 min drive.


View Larger Map

Tamta wrote:Sierra LaMar suspect being investigated for three 2009 Morgan Hill assaults


Morgan Hill police on Wednesday said they are looking into the possibility Garcia-Torres was involved in all three.

"The fact three of these happened in 2009 in such a short period of time, we're investigating and trying to see if he's responsible for all three," Morgan Hill police Sgt. Troy Hoefling said.

"Very seldom do cases happen in such
proximity (that) they are not related. But obviously we need to prove that."


More:

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20692280/sierra-lamar-suspect-being-investigated-three-2009-morgan

That's what I had suspected yesterday when Smith couldn't "remember" which of the 3 assaults were positively linked to Torres (turns out she was referring to the taser incident) -- I speculated she couldn't remember the specifics because she actually had been considering all three to be linked. If you thought only one was linke and the other two were not -- you would *not* forget the details of the one.

The liklihood that assaults occurring at two Safeways located blocks from each other in only a two week span committed by completely different individuals by coincidence is highly improbable.

Stolat wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
Body found in Pleasanton

PLEASANTON -- A body was discovered Thursday near Dublin Canyon Road and Laurel Creek drive, police said.
Representatives from the Alameda County Coroner's office loaded a gurney containing the body, in white bag, into a van and drove away from the area about 3 p.m., police said.

That looks closer to Freemont than to Morgan Hill.

How interesting....

more interesting when you look at it relative to Morgan Hill -- straight shot up north using Hwy 680 all the way. Just a 45 min drive.


View Larger Map

http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
BBM

The age and gender of the body have not yet been positively determined by the Alameda County Coroner's Office, and police offered no immediate details. But sources said late Thursday that the body, which has long hair and painted nails, likely is female. However, based on decomposition and age, authorities don't believe it is missing Morgan Hill 15-year-old Sierra Lamar.

Tamta wrote:Sierra Lamar kidnapping suspect: I was fishing



Garcia-Torres told his mother that he could not be Sierra's kidnapper because he was busy fishing at the Uvas Creek in Morgan Hill on March 16.

Witnesses told investigators that they saw Garcia-Torres' Jetta driving around Sierra's neighborhood the morning she vanished.



Read more: http://www.ksbw.com/news/central-california/hollister-gilroy/Sierra-Lamar-kidnapping-suspect-I-was-fishing/-/5738758/14154804/-/3v7isn/-/index.html#ixzz1vt2cxv9z

http://www.ksbw.com/news/central-california/hollister-gilroy/Sierra-Lamar-kidnapping-suspect-I-was-fishing/-/5738758/14154804/-/item/0/-/taxln5/-/index.html

I'm reposting this from yesteday. The article below either suggests a contradiction in reporting - or suggests that he went fishing TWO days in a row (?) I wish these people would get their facts straight
---
Sources close to the investigation say the suspect told them early on that he often went fishing around Morgan Hill.

Garcia-Torres mother said on the day after Sierra's disappearance her son went to the reservoir.

"He went back to go fishing at Uvas, Uvas Park," said his mother, Laura Torres.

http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/crime-law/lloyd/nPC3r/

Tamta wrote:

Stolat wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
Body found in Pleasanton

PLEASANTON -- A body was discovered Thursday near Dublin Canyon Road and Laurel Creek drive, police said.
Representatives from the Alameda County Coroner's office loaded a gurney containing the body, in white bag, into a van and drove away from the area about 3 p.m., police said.

That looks closer to Freemont than to Morgan Hill.

How interesting....

more interesting when you look at it relative to Morgan Hill -- straight shot up north using Hwy 680 all the way. Just a 45 min drive.


View Larger Map

http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
BBM

The age and gender of the body have not yet been positively determined by the Alameda County Coroner's Office, and police offered no immediate details. But sources said late Thursday that the body, which has long hair and painted nails, likely is female. However, based on decomposition and age, authorities don't believe it is missing Morgan Hill 15-year-old Sierra Lamar.

True - and likely since he's been under surveillance it's improbably he'd have a chance to do much since he had been identified.

Stolat wrote:

Tamta wrote:Sierra LaMar suspect being investigated for three 2009 Morgan Hill assaults


Morgan Hill police on Wednesday said they are looking into the possibility Garcia-Torres was involved in all three.

"The fact three of these happened in 2009 in such a short period of time, we're investigating and trying to see if he's responsible for all three," Morgan Hill police Sgt. Troy Hoefling said.

"Very seldom do cases happen in such
proximity (that) they are not related. But obviously we need to prove that."


More:

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20692280/sierra-lamar-suspect-being-investigated-three-2009-morgan

That's what I had suspected yesterday when Smith couldn't "remember" which of the 3 assaults were positively linked to Torres (turns out she was referring to the taser incident) -- I speculated she couldn't remember the specifics because she actually had been considering all three to be linked. If you thought only one was linke and the other two were not -- you would *not* forget the details of the one.

The liklihood that assaults occurring at two Safeways located blocks from each other in only a two week span committed by completely different individuals by coincidence is highly improbable.

This is not a comment on my opinion as to whether or not these cases are linked to Torres, however my experience of Smith has revealed that she 'can not remember' or 'is not sure' when she does not want to be put in the situation where she has to offer specifics.

Stolat wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Stolat wrote:

Tamta wrote:

Honeysage wrote:http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
Body found in Pleasanton

PLEASANTON -- A body was discovered Thursday near Dublin Canyon Road and Laurel Creek drive, police said.
Representatives from the Alameda County Coroner's office loaded a gurney containing the body, in white bag, into a van and drove away from the area about 3 p.m., police said.

That looks closer to Freemont than to Morgan Hill.

How interesting....

more interesting when you look at it relative to Morgan Hill -- straight shot up north using Hwy 680 all the way. Just a 45 min drive.


View Larger Map

http://www.contracostatimes.com/top-stories/ci_20703484/crime-scene-investigation-under-way-pleasanton
BBM

The age and gender of the body have not yet been positively determined by the Alameda County Coroner's Office, and police offered no immediate details. But sources said late Thursday that the body, which has long hair and painted nails, likely is female. However, based on decomposition and age, authorities don't believe it is missing Morgan Hill 15-year-old Sierra Lamar.

True - and likely since he's been under surveillance it's improbably he'd have a chance to do much since he had been identified.

If he did it she is probably in water, shallow grave, or a concrete wall.