Kyron Horman -- Missing 6/4/10 #2

I don't even want to speculate...Spating spouses never do solve anything until one decides to stop and really listen...I find it hard to believe that Kaine didn't know his relationship with Terri was jeopardized with her hard feelings of him...Was he really that oblivious about his relationship and thought everything was hunky dory???

Kaine is the one who stated Terri suffered from depression with the birth of Kiara. Which as was mentioned in previous posts, she could have been asking for help and Kaine and Dez didn't give her any.

As far as the polys go, yes, the are inadmissable.

A person suffering from depression, having their step son disappear, the poly may have been the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak. She may also be claustrophobic and flipped out when tied into the chair for the poly.

Also, to those who questioned Terri's response vs Dez's response, if Terri was on antidepressants, her reactions may not have been as gut wrenched as Dez's due to the medication. Also people respond to grief differently.

Estee,

He may have been in denial- especially if he was carrying on an affair behind Terri's back.

Maybe his relationship was okay, and he's just been the victim of the LE strategy of divide and isolate the "suspect." (And the caregiver is always the suspect.)I also think Desiree Young, in her grief maybe, has used her press conferences and this investigation to settle a lot of old scores.

I just can't help but feel immense sorrow for Terri Horman. She was the one who did the everyday mothering to Kyron, and she's the one who ends up villified and abandoned by almost everybody.

Off Topic, but I'm sorry I just have to ask this:

Calypso, what is your avatar?

lc wrote:Maybe his relationship was okay, and he's just been the victim of the LE strategy of divide and isolate the "suspect." (And the caregiver is always the suspect.)I also think Desiree Young, in her grief maybe, has used her press conferences and this investigation to settle a lot of old scores.

I just can't help but feel immense sorrow for Terri Horman. She was the one who did the everyday mothering to Kyron, and she's the one who ends up villified and abandoned by almost everybody.

Anything is possible in this case. I agree with you on the Dez aspect of settling up old scores weither they were conciously done or not.

Terri seemed like the go between two parents who were more interested in their own lives and careers. Out of the two of them, I see Kaine being more involved with Kyron than Dez. At least there are many more photos of Kaine and Kyron than there are of Dez and Kyron. I also assume Terri was the photographer of these photos.

Two days into Kyron's disappearance, the police were saying this was an isolated incident.

How could they have said that at that time?



Does anyone else get pissed off and aggravated discussing this case?

That's an octopus Mama!!!

lc wrote:Or course, we don't even know if Terri even "failed" those polygraphs. I understand it's common in some investigations to tell a suspect s/he "failed" when the suspect didn't.

Frankly, it doesn't matter to me if she failed or not, I just don't believe in polygraphs.

Welcome Ic!

I'm with you on the whole poly thing. I don't care either if she passed or failed and I don't put any stock in Dez and Kaine passing either.

I also can't stand Dez and Kaine making such a big deal of how Terri walked off from the poly and blah blah blah as some sort of proof of her guilt! Are these 2 so cold and/or hateful they don't realize Terri may have been upset about Kryon being missing and was afraid her stress of genuine worry may cause a bad read? Do they not realize if Terri felt like she was being targeted by the questions she might want to stop the test even if she was innocent? I would stop it in a heartbeat if I were innocent and I was feeling stressed by leading questions that might give a false reading. By contrast, many sociopaths have passed poly's with flying colors even though they actually did commit horrendous crimes.

LE, Kaine, Dez and Tony and the Media can take their polys and stuff it. 8)

Two days into Kyron's disappearance, the police were saying this was an isolated incident.

How could they have said that at that time?

Because the caregiver is always the suspect. The statistics are on LE's side. I think 80 percent of child murders are committed by a parent or caregiver, and sometimes LE develops tunnel vision of who a suspect should be.

Google Kevin Fox's name.

Thanks for the welcome, LottieM. And I want to tell you that I thought your post yesterday, about Kaine and Dez's guilt, was superb.

T Rex sez he wants some answers!

lc~

Like so many cases, I fear Kyron's will fall into the same catagory.

Unfortunately, whoever is responsible has a two month head start. That's ALOT of time!

Calypso, I totally agree that will be that will be the likely outcome, with Terri Horman always being the uncharged suspect.

I've wondered, also, if maybe Kyron was the victim of a horrible accident, an abandoned well, etcetera.

lc wrote:Or course, we don't even know if Terri even "failed" those polygraphs. I understand it's common in some investigations to tell a suspect s/he "failed" when the suspect didn't.

Frankly, it doesn't matter to me if she failed or not, I just don't believe in polygraphs.

Welcome ic! I could not agree more....... lie detectors as an investigational tool are iffy at best..... but can help direct an investigation. They are not evidence. And, once again, like the Haleigh case- we have heard all kinds of number of lie detector tests that so-and-so took and passed/failed, how many, etc...... but NOT FROM LE. In truth, we have no idea what these lie detector tests showed, and a person saying that they or someone else took X number of polygraphs and passed or failed does not impress me.

Welcome on board! kh

Have any of you guys read anywhere that Tony and Dez and Kaine took their polys in Medford?

I think we discussed this way back in the beginning, when the 3 stooges said Terri had failed 2 polys, D & K said they passed with flying colors, and someone asked what flying colors meant?

Does anyone else remember this?

Another person who we never discussed is Dez's ex husband Greg. The one who Terri went to Quinn's birthday party with. I believe he and his wife live in the same area as the Horman's did.

These are the reports I just foundd. I'm trying to find documentation of where they took their polys.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/97904344.html

Have you been asked to take polygraphs? If so, did you take them?

Yes, all 3 of us have taken polygraphs and passed. We have voluntarily undergone any and all sessions with law enforcement and will continue to do so, to bring Kyron home. We wake up every day and check in to proactively see what else we can do to help with the case and to find Kyron. We are relentless in this focus.


http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/horman_family_answers_question.html

Have you been asked to take polygraphs? If so, did you take them?

"Yes, all 3 of us have taken polygraphs and have voluntarily undergone any and all sessions with law enforcement and will continue to do so as long as it takes to bring Kyron home. We wake up every day and check in to proactively see what else we can do to help with the case and to find Kyron. We are relentless in this focus."


http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Second-grade-student-missing-from-Skyline-Elementary-95670454.html

Family members pass lie detector

Kyron's parents, Kaine and Desiree, released a statement Monday answering questions about the investigation. They indicated they've taken lie detector tests and a reliable source told KGW that Kaine, Desiree, and Tony all passed the test.

Another person who we never discussed is Dez's ex husband Greg. The one who Terri went to Quinn's birthday party with. I believe he and his wife live in the same area as the Horman's did.

I would love to hear what he has to say. I think one thing we might learn is that Desiree isn't the devoted every-other-weekend mother she wants everyone to believe she is, that she didn't exercise her visitation rights nearly that often.

http://www.anorak.co.uk/253157/media/kyron-horman-tony-young-and-the-failed-police-plot-to-entrap-terri-horman.html

Tuesday, Desiree Young clarified that she, her husband and Kyron’s father all took polygraph exams in the case and were told they passed.

A polygraph is not evidence. And didn’t Terri Horman take two such tests? Were all tests taken at Medford police headquarters?

Terri Horman has taken two polygraph tests, after authorities said a key answer on the first exam found her deceptive.

Good that the police leaked that bit of information. But what does it prove, other than that the police are desperate for a confession?

Also Tuesday, Kyron’s mother issued a fresh appeal for the stepmother to cooperate with police. Desiree and Tony Young called a news conference at police headquarters in Medford.

Medford police headquarters – where Tony Young works. No suggestion and no proof that he is leaking news to the media and the fmaily. But this story is a shocker for anyone who thought good detective work was based on facts and evidence.

Calypso wrote:http://www.anorak.co.uk/253157/media/kyron-horman-tony-young-and-the-failed-police-plot-to-entrap-terri-horman.html

The comments at this link are interesting. Some guy claiming to know Tony personally and a psychic!

Gotta tell y'all....I hate psychics! Errr...I mean crazies claiming to be psychics.

From what I read somewhere previously, when Kaine moved out of the family home, he moved in with a female coworker whose name did start with a "P". I got blasted on another site for mentioning it. And that was before the Mike Cook stuff came out. But, why is okay for Kaine to move in with another woman, but Terri must be punished for sending naughty text messages (if they were truly naughty and if she was the one who truly sent them).

I still believe it was a random kidnapping. I think someone saw a crime of opportunity, but I also think Kaine stinks to high heavens and all these people must have severe sinus congestion.

Yeah, if the psychics are so smart, why don't they just go find the poor boy.

Kyron investigators search where stepmom's friend gardened

by Colin Miner, KGW Staff
Posted on August 9, 2010 at 5:53 AM

PORTLAND -- On Sunday, investigators looking into the disappearance of Kyron Horman spent hours searching a large property where Dede Spicher was gardening on June 4th, the day that Kyron disappeared.

Investigators know that Spicher, a good friend of Kyron's step-mother, Terri, disappeared for more than an hour that day and has not been able to fully account for her whereabouts.

This property is at least the third connected to Spicher that has been searched as part of the investigation. Investigators have also looked at her condo and a house belonging to relatives of hers.

Read more here:
http://www.krem.com/news/northwest-news/Kyron-investigators-search-where-stepmoms-friend-gardened-100255949.html

Hi lc! Welcome to RC

I've been MIA over the weekend, so I have a lot of catching up to do I see...

I'm wondering about DeDe's involvement... it almost seems like she's leading LE on a wild goose chase here - she has directed them to 3 properties now??? Could be that she is directing them AWAY from where Kyron truly is - or maybe she just likes the attention and is telling them to look here there and everywhere...

About the chips - I have them in my dogs, but doubt I would put them in my kids - I feel like it's a violation of our rights - AND I know the argument is that it could prevent cases like this - or identify victims - however, I don't believe that it would assist in identifying any victims - as the chip is embedded into skin and not bone, it would be exposed to the elements as the body decomposes or could be eaten by various wild animals that prey on a decomposing body... I just don't buy into that - and won't get one based on the verses that Calypso posted a few pages ago...

I don't put much stock in poly's - I realize they are only a "tool", but even then, innocent ppl fail them and guilty ppl pass them all the time... there are MANY documented cases of this happening - and all a poly is good for is helping LE justify putting blinders on in a case...

I think Terri was a peace keeper - I can't believe how well she "blended" this family - I think she was probably the glue that kept them all together. That she would take Kyron to his step brothers bday party w/o Kaine being in attendance or Dez being there speaks volumes to me - I don't even know that I would do that really... but I know that she did, for Kyron's sake - because those with blended families know -that's the ONLY reason you do stuff like that. I'm sure Kyron wanted to go, and so Terri took him by herself so Kyron could attend and see his brother. I'm sure that had to be uncomfortable for her, and I'm sure that she had better things to do that day... but she went anyway - for Kyron...

Lottie, you wrote a very good post about family dyanamics a few pages ago - something you said about Kyron possibly being disappointed that Dez or Kaine weren't going to attend the science fair - now this is going to be a long shot, but certainly no more than any other theories are - I just WONDER - did they ever check out the possibility that Kyron ran away? I know it doesn't seem like he would, he was only 7, 2nd grade, seems like a normal home life, no scuffles w/ friends or parents, etc... but what if he walked out of the school on his own free will and then something bad happened to him? did they check that angle? I don't think they did, considering we just found out that they had STILL not compiled a list of school employees until just recently. I think LE has been on Terri since day one - and possibly rightfully so - perhaps they DO have evidence that we are unaware of - but then why so long in making an arrest?

{waving at lc!} Welcome aboard!

Piper wrote:Kyron investigators search where stepmom's friend gardened

by Colin Miner, KGW Staff



Posted on August 9, 2010 at 5:53 AM

PORTLAND -- On Sunday, investigators looking into the disappearance of Kyron Horman spent hours searching a large property where Dede Spicher was gardening on June 4th, the day that Kyron disappeared.

Investigators know that Spicher, a good friend of Kyron's step-mother, Terri, disappeared for more than an hour that day and has not been able to fully account for her whereabouts.

This property is at least the third connected to Spicher that has been searched as part of the investigation. Investigators have also looked at her condo and a house belonging to relatives of hers.

Read more here:
http://www.krem.com/news/northwest-news/Kyron-investigators-search-where-stepmoms-friend-gardened-100255949.html

So, this speaks volumes.
Sounds like they are going after Dede Spicher now.

Sounds more like harassing DeDe Spicher.

This investigation has turned into a real circle-jerk.

Of course, LE is checking out De De, as she is a friend of Terri's, and they have been convinced Terri is the guilty party, and they think De De may have helped her. Of course they are going to check out her home, family members home and where she was working on June 4th.

However, if they don't find anything connected to Kyron, it just proves she did nothing with him. She is not leading them to these places, it is obvious they would just check out these places because they want to find something on her and Terri.

I'm sure what LE is doing is not bothering De De at all, as she has nothing to hide.

Excellent post, Mama. I certainly agree they will check every place known to DeDe.

Kyron Horman case: A motive, an accomplice and a conference

Posted on August 9th, 2010 by Valhall

KGW is reporting that at least two witnesses have stated that another adult was in Terri’s white Ford F250 pickup while she was in the school the morning of June 4th. The article goes on to state investigators have been trying to establish the identity of this person by scouring through Terri’s phone calls and emails. Information has not been released as to DeDe Spicher’s whereabouts during the period of time Terri and Kyron were at Skyline Elementary, so it cannot be established whether DeDe could be the person seen waiting in the truck. A second adult waiting in the pickup could explain why there has been no account of Kiara being inside the school that morning. It could also begin to explain how Terri pulled off getting Kyron out of the school without someone seeing her with him as she left.

Read more:
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2010/08/09/kyron-horman-case-a-motive-an-accomplice-and-a-conference/#comments

How would that explain how she managed to get a child out of the school without being seen? If they were sitting in the vehicle with a baby, then Terri (a person well known at the school) would still have to walk out with a child. Through a normal door, people would be stopping her and saying things like, "You're not leaving are you? Kyron's going to miss all the fun today."

If she tried sneaking out a door that is not normally used, being so known at the school, someone would notice a person who knows better using the wrong door. It would stand out. A stranger using that door wouldn't because too many strangers were wandering around, and they get lost and use the wrong doors.

If this previously never heard of "adult" left an unattended baby in the vehicle, people would be screaming about the evil Terri who left a baby alone in a car! They suddenly have an "adult" who has no sex mentioned, no descriptive information, nothing. Makes me doubt the veracity of this information. Sounds like a fill-in-the-blank storyline.

As I read through this story closer, it is still a stab in the dark and making up the story as they go. Obviously, not a real sharp tool in the shed!

Here is my interpretation of the story:

Let's PRETEND a previously invisible adult was there! That helps the story fit better. Yeah! That's what happened!!! And Terri told Kyron to go out there, and she planned the whole thing.

How do we know this? She was ticked off about James. She complained about him having to move (which happened months before) and complained to people MONTHS before. That proves she is a crazy witch! What kind of woman would be upset that her child moved away! She must be psycho! It is all the proof we need! Someone! Get that stake up! Light the fire!

I still don't see ANY proof in this. Just a new story where someone made up some facts with no thought to reality.

I don't know what to think of this unidentified person in the truck. No one has ever stated Kiara was in the school with Terri, that I've heard. How long as LE thought this and did actual witnesses see another person?

E-mails: Stepmom sensed suspicion on her day after disappearance

By Anita Kissée KATU News and KATU.com Staff
Story Updated: Aug 9, 2010 at 11:55 PM PDT

PORTLAND, Ore. - Long before the alleged murder-for-hire plot and sexting affairs, it seems Terri Moulton Horman knew suspicions settled on her, according to e-mails written by Horman and obtained by KATU News.

“They are blaming me in the blogs. I just want to scream,” she wrote in one e-mail to a KATU News source the day after her stepson, Kyron Horman vanished from Skyline School during a science fair. Investigators say Terri Horman was the last person to see Kyron.

“The teacher thought I said I was going to take Kyron with Kitty for a doctor’s appt.,” she wrote on June 5, 2010. “I said I was going to look at other exhibits - how do you mess that up? His coat and backpack were still at school. I left the school at 9 and he was seen with a man ‘chaperone’ and 2 girls after I left. There were no men on the chaperone list. That and it was highly chaotic - had to been 300 people running around - no coordination ...”

Read more:
http://www.katu.com/news/local/100323934.html

Snipped from the above article:

In a press release Monday afternoon, the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office said it plans to hold a news conference on Wednesday, Aug. 11 at 11 a.m. to release details in the case in an effort to get the public’s help in the case. KATU.com plans to stream it live.

I wonder if the police will release REAL facts or continue to allow the public to make up their own stories and call them the truth?

I am a bit confused about something......

It has been widely reported that friends of Terri purchased "throw away" or "disposable" phones AND that they used false names.

I use a Net10 phone that I purchased at the local Dollar General store with so many minutes on it for my car. I never had to give my name or anyone else's for that matter to purchase this phone.

Can someone clear up my confusion?
Thx.
kh

From Terri's email:

“The teacher thought I said I was going to take Kyron with Kitty for a doctor’s appt.,” she wrote on June 5, 2010. “I said I was going to look at other exhibits - how do you mess that up? His coat and backpack were still at school. I left the school at 9 and he was seen with a man ‘chaperone’ and 2 girls after I left. There were no men on the chaperone list. That and it was highly chaotic - had to been 300 people running around - no coordination ...”


Has LE found out who this male chaperone and 2 girls are, I wonder. Also, it was originally stated Terri left the school at 8:45. In her own words she states she left at 9am.

kh, I'm not sure about that. I would think a disposable phone would be just that, no contract, no name, no account.

That's what I mean, Piper. I can buy a phone- it may or may not come with minutes- but you can always by the minutes in increments...... no contracts.... and no names.
kh

Massive Renewed Search for 7-Year-Old Kyron Horman as New 'Case Details' to Be Released

Published August 10, 2010
FoxNews.com

Investigators in Oregon renewed their massive search this week for missing 7-year-old Kyron Horman, The Oregonian reports, and plan to release further "case details" on Wednesday regarding a report that another person was in the car with the second-grader's stepmother when she dropped him of at school the day he disappeared.

Read more:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/08/10/massive-renewed-search-year-old-kyron-horman-new-case-details-released/?test=latestnews

I too a confused that it has taken over two months to determine that there was someone else in her truck parked right outside the front of the school, which I understand is a small, rural type school and not a vast campus like we see in larger towns.

Living in small town myself, I can tell ya...... newz spreads fast. And most people notice me and could tell you where I was and what I was doin....... not being nosy, it's just that small a town. If I stop at the liquor store, both preachers and all the deacons of all the collective churches know it! If my car is gone (I work at home so that is unusual), they know it. If I buy cigarettes or gas, they know it. If I do or do not attend the PTA meeting, they know it. I am sure you're gettin the eye deer.

I drop my littlest one off at school in the morning. She rides the bus home. If someone else dropped her off or there was another person in my vehicle or driving my vehicle, it would not go unnoticed. And it wouldn't take two months to figure out.


kh

Piper wrote:From Terri's email:

“The teacher thought I said I was going to take Kyron with Kitty for a doctor’s appt.,” she wrote on June 5, 2010. “I said I was going to look at other exhibits - how do you mess that up? His coat and backpack were still at school. I left the school at 9 and he was seen with a man ‘chaperone’ and 2 girls after I left. There were no men on the chaperone list. That and it was highly chaotic - had to been 300 people running around - no coordination ...”


Has LE found out who this male chaperone and 2 girls are, I wonder. Also, it was originally stated Terri left the school at 8:45. In her own words she states she left at 9am.

Also, if I remember correctly, it came out somewhere Kaine advised Terri not to speak to anyone.

All along Terri has maintained her silence, so this is the first "statement" we are hearing from Terri if in fact this is accurate and was made by Terri after Kyron's disappearance.

When was this email sent and to whom and has it been confirmed?

http://www.katu.com/news/local/100323934.html

E-mails: Stepmom sensed suspicion on her day after disappearance

By Anita Kissée KATU News and KATU.com Staff

Story Published: Aug 9, 2010 at 11:14 PM PDT
Story Updated: Aug 9, 2010 at 11:55 PM PDT

**SNIPPED:

Horman went on to talk about Kyron’s recent behavior.

"The past 2 weeks he's been acting really weird. Staring off into space. Can't remember anything. Walks into the room and then back out, stopping to stare and then move on. The doc thinks that he is having mini seizures and I made an appt on Thursday for next Friday to have him checked out."

Simoni said the boy, with the homeless black man, whom she gave bread, jam and a bottle of water to (and he gave it to the boy), that the boy just stared at her. I've written to her today and asked her if anyone's been in touch.

I'm confused. Where did this come from??

Simoni said the boy, with the homeless black man, whom she gave bread, jam and a bottle of water to (and he gave it to the boy), that the boy just stared at her. I've written to her today and asked her if anyone's been in touch.

E-mails: Stepmom sensed suspicion on her day after disappearance

Story Published: Aug 9, 2010 at 11:14 PM PDT
Story Updated: Aug 9, 2010 at 11:55 PM PDT

PORTLAND, Ore. - Long before the alleged murder-for-hire plot and sexting affairs, it seems Terri Moulton Horman knew suspicions settled on her, according to e-mails written by Horman and obtained by KATU News.

“They are blaming me in the blogs. I just want to scream,” she wrote in one e-mail to a KATU News source the day after her stepson, Kyron Horman vanished from Skyline School during a science fair. Investigators say Terri Horman was the last person to see Kyron.

“The teacher thought I said I was going to take Kyron with Kitty for a doctor’s appt.,” she wrote on June 5, 2010. “I said I was going to look at other exhibits - how do you mess that up? His coat and backpack were still at school. I left the school at 9 and he was seen with a man ‘chaperone’ and 2 girls after I left. There were no men on the chaperone list. That and it was highly chaotic - had to been 300 people running around - no coordination ...”

The reference to her daughter’s doctor visit not mentioned again in a follow-up e-mail sent later that day:

"I didn't just drop him off, I spent time with him, took pictures and he was in safe hands I thought as I watched him walk down the hall.

“Kids saw him after I left. Teacher put him as absent at 10am. Someplace between 9-10 is when we think it happened.

“I have a receipt showing I was checking out at Fred Meyer 7 miles away at 9:12am. I went to another FM looking for meds for Kitty they didn't have at the first FM. Then I was trying to get Kitty to sleep in the truck for a few minutes, but no go, so off to the gym at 11:20. Out at 12:20. Home at 12:45. Kaine home at 2. Bus at 3:30. That was my day - they keep asking me. Now on my 5th interview with them ..."

Horman went on to talk about Kyron’s recent behavior.

"The past 2 weeks he's been acting really weird. Staring off into space. Can't remember anything. Walks into the room and then back out, stopping to stare and then move on. The doc thinks that he is having mini seizures and I made an appt on Thursday for next Friday to have him checked out."

That contradicts what multiple sources have told KATU News. In the days before the science fair, Terri informed Kyron’s teacher he had the appointment that day, June 4, which is why no one expected he would be in class and was marked absent.

Meanwhile on Monday, an acquaintance of Terri Horman said Terri was very upset the weeks before Kyron vanished because she said her husband, Kaine, was making her teenage son move out of the couple’s home.

Also on Monday, friends of Terri who worked out with her at 24-Hour Fitness testified before a grand jury.

According to sources, the friends were not extremely close to Terri but they were close enough that Terri often confided in them with issues from her home.

The Oregonian reported on Monday that investigators are trying to learn if another adult was sitting in the white pickup truck that Terri Horman drove to Skyline School on the day Kyron disappeared.

The newspaper reports the person may have been in the truck while Terri was with Kyron at the science fair.

Lt. Mary Lindstrand, spokeswoman for the Multnomah County Sheriff's Office, said Monday night she cannot comment on details of an open investigation.

In a press release Monday afternoon, the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office said it plans to hold a news conference on Wednesday, Aug. 11 at 11 a.m. to release details in the case in an effort to get the public’s help in the case. KATU.com plans to stream it live.

I vaguely remember some reports about a homeless man with a boy.......... I can't remember where. kh

Fysty, KH, bottom of this page:

http://www.realitychatter.com/kyron-horman-f70/sex-offender-stranger-abduction-t2569.htm