Ayla Reynolds -- Missing 12/17/11

PINSKY: Joining us Ken Altshuler, excuse me. He`s radio talk show host on WGAN 560.

Ken, can you give us any update on Ayla`s dad and his court appearance?

KEN ALTSHULER, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Yes, I can. He was in court, Justin DiPeitro, was in court for allegedly assaulting his section girlfriend Courtney Roberts. Remember, Courtney was the girlfriend in the house with him on December 17th, 2011 when Ayla went missing, as well as his sister, Alisha.

So, he was in court for allegedly assaulting her and for violating the terms of your bail. The real drama happened when his family was in the courtroom and she muttered a derogatory word to Ron Reynolds. She started yelling that her son kids his granddaughter, the fight went out to the hallway, marshals cleared everybody in the courtroom, all of them kicked out of the courthouse, except, of course, Justin DiPeitro, because he has to plead guilty to violating the bail conditions. He was not found guilty, did not plead guilty to the assault. That was a (INAUDIBLE) because his girlfriend changed her story. So, he`s got four days in jail for (INAUDIBLE) --

PINSKY: Ken, if I could interrupt, we`re also looking at the mom as sort of following this young man around, and sort of chastising him. I guess she was outside the courtroom yelling at him as well. Is that correct?

ALTSHULER: Exactly. This is the second confrontation. And this is drama we don`t see in Maine too often, Dr. Drew. As he came out of the courtroom about an hour later, the family confronted both him and Phoebe DiPeitro again. In fact Ella Reynolds yelled at Phoebe, what did you do with Ayla? When she said that, then Trista followed Justin DiPeitro and said, I know you care, what did you do with her?

He had to escape, Dr. Drew, by going to the police department which is right behind --

PINSKY: Ken, I`m interrupting you, because apparently I have footage of some of that actual interaction, so thank you very much for that report. I still have Ken, Lynn, Mark and Crystal. I beg your pardon, Lynn, Mark and Krystal with us and joining us is David Young, former criminal court judge and host of "Justice with a Snap".

As we said, here was the confrontation outside the courtroom today. Take a look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just look at me, Justin, look at me.

(EXPLETIVE DELETED)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justin, please -- Justin, look me in the eye.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am Ayla`s grandmother and I believe she`s alive.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I am her mother!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. We believe that she`s alive and tell us what you did with her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: So, Lynn, police have showed bloody images from inside the house, and why now two years later? Why the delay in getting the crime scene stabilized? There`s so many unanswered questions.

BERRY: There are so many unanswered questions. The big question is why is Trista coming out to the media and telling what police told her? Police are not approving of that. She says it`s to put pressure on the state to put charges against Justin. She believes he`s responsible for Ayla`s death.

PINSKY: Judge Young, do you think --

BERRY: This is --

PINSKY: Go ahead, finish, Lynn.

BERRY: There`s theories out there all around whether or not the police put it before both of them to see who would react and in what way?

PINSKY: I don`t know.

Judge, what do you think they`re up to?

JUDGE DAVID YOUNG, FORMER CRIMINAL COURT JUDGE: I think the right hand doesn`t know what the left hand is doing. It seems after two years, in such a small community, they don`t know what`s going on? And leaking certain evidence to the mother who spouts it out? Her comments in and of itself could possibly mess up this investigation, and they had all this blood in the father`s house and they have not made an arrest? They haven`t connected anything up?

What`s going on there? It`s horrible --

PINSKY: Mark, you let out a big oy. I`m wondering what, if you`re the lawyer for the baby`s father, what do you tell him to do?

EIGLARSH: OK. First of all my oy is this was like "Jerry Springer Live" outside a courthouse when there`s a pending murder investigation. You have a gal who`s right out of rehab, Drew. This can`t be good for her sobriety to make confrontations like this. But what do I tell him to do?

Now, I get to play the devil`s role, I guess. And that is, I tell him to keep his mouth shut. Obviously, they have strong evidence that had probably was involved. Beyond a reasonable doubt, that he probably knows if not played a role, but that`s not proof beyond a reasonable doubt, and they cannot arrest him based on what I have seen, because you can`t eliminate every reasonable hypothesis of innocence.

PINSKY: I love Mark playing -- him doing the devil`s job, but, Crystal, finish this up.

EIGLARSH: Well, I agree with Mark, this is probably one of the few times that I agree with Mark, that it happens, but I think two things -- one thing that nobody said, what troubles me is nobody is mentioning the fact that neither Trista or Justin were ever married, Dr. Drew.

PINSKY: Yes, I`m aware of that.

EIGLARSH: This goes back to, she was a druggie, and she`s been in rehab, very unstable. He looks like there`s a lot of evidence, like Mark said, attaching him to something of foul play going on with his daughter. You had blood on the sheets. Blood found on the kids` toys, her little slippers. There was vomit in the car, blood in the car.

And it`s just unseemly all the way around. But I want to go back to the fact that why aren`t we asking questions about people can just have babies and abandon, they don`t have to get married?

I think people should have to get licenses to have children. They have to have licenses to drive. We`ve got to get licenses to get married.

This is the real -- the failure here starts with the fact that these two individuals never should have had this baby, and tragically now, she`s dead.

PINSKY: I`m going to let that fall on our viewers` ears, but there was, you know, back when Carolla and I used to do "The Love Line", we always said the same thing over again, the real problem is screwed up people having screwed up kids. That`s what the cycle is going.

But hold it on here. Behavior bureau is getting to the bottom of the missing child mystery and I`ve got Baby Ayla`s grandfather is here with us live.

And later, the killer`s good friend is going to join me. He says this murdering pal of his was caring and helpful, and maybe not the guy we think of. It`s confusing. I think it`s even confusing to him.

We`ll get to it after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can`t comment on the blood that was around the house?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Again, I`m not here to answer any questions. I`m just here to show my support for the community that is supporting Ayla.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Time for the behavior bureau. My co-host, Jenny Hutt. And we are discussing the missing baby Ayla. Her father was the last one to have seen her two years ago. He was in court today on a domestic violence charge, and things got crazy outside, even in the courtroom.

Joining us, Samantha Schacher, host of "Pop Trigger" on the Young Turks Network, criminologist and attorney Casey Jordan, host of "Wives with Knives" on Investigation Discovery, Danine Manette, criminal investigator and author of "Ultimate Betrayal", and Janine Driver, the author of "You Can`t Lie to Me."

Janine, you have a screwy connection with us here through your Skype, I`m wondering if you had a chance to look at him in the court today, his domestic violence charges. Did you see anything?

JANINE DRIVER, "YOU CAN`T LIE TO ME": I did, Dr. Drew. Can you hear me?

PINSKY: Loud and clear.

DRIVER: I`m in New Mexico.

PINSKY: Say hi to Walter White for me while you`re down there.

DRIVER: Yes, I will. I`m sure he`s play praying for you, too, and being cancer-free.

PINSKY: Thanks.

DRIVER: Very brave, I was so proud of you sharing that news.

Listen, with (INAUDIBLE), it`s very interesting. He`s very reserved. He pulls himself in a lot. We don`t see a lot of emotions. The emotion I`m looking for is anger.

He should be angry, Dr. Drew, that the baby mama is showing up with his family, calling her a murder. I`m simply not seeing anger. I`m actually seeing more sadness with a furrowed brow, which makes me concerned that maybe in fact he did kill his daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

PINSKY: Wow. Interesting.

Sam, you want to react to that?

SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. I mean, obviously, emotions were high today outside the courtroom, but how can you blame Trista? I mean, if I were here, I would do far worse than berate him with questions. I probably would have been locked up. Clearly based on this evidence, this guy did murder his child.

PINSKY: I know Jenny would have been like you, Sam. But I`m watching Danine shake her head in ominous way.

What do you have to say there for this?

DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: Dr. Drew, this is has been a mess. The only thing that I think is going to cause a break is for them to attack the weakest link. And the weakest link here is Courtney.

She`s keeping quiet for one of two reasons, either because he has convinced her -- Justin has convinced her she was involved to be just as culpable as him and she`ll go down with him if she says anything. Or maybe she did help. Maybe she did help, you know, with the disposing of the body or cleaning up after the fact or whatever.

So, I think they need to isolate her, find a reason to arrest her, maybe on a three-day weekend, so the judicial calendar won`t wind, and she doesn`t have to be charged until Monday or Tuesday, and work her over. Put the squeeze on her. Put her kid in foster care, and squeeze this information out of her.

PINSKY: Casey, what do you think?

MANETTE: She`s the weak link. She`s get them somewhere.

PINSKY: Casey?

JORDAN: I like what Danine is saying, but the only plot hole is what if Courtney did it? If she did it, she`s not going to crack. And considering that you have Justin with domestic violence assault charges on Courtney right now, now might be a good time to revisit Justin.

But to be honest, this case is two years old, at this point, he`s in this wonderful, placated mode where he thinks he`s gotten away with it, assuming he did it. And I think the evidence point at him.

You have three people -- I`m agreeing with Danine, you have a trial of three people who know something.

PINSKY: Yes.

JORDAN: You got to play them against each other if you want to figure it out.

PINSKY: I want to bring into this conversation Jeff Hansen. He is Baby Ayla`s step-grandfather.

Jeff, you were at the courthouse today. Things got chaotic today. You`ve heard our conversation here. What do you got to say?

JEFF HANSON, BABY AYLA`S STEP-GRANDFATHER (via telephone): Well, Dr. Drew, I believe Phoebe initiated it. She called (INAUDIBLE) an insult as she was walking by. That set things off. And, there was still a press conference that went on afterwards, but when we went out in front of the courthouse, Phoebe was sitting there, and Trista had had enough, and she went over and confronted her.

PINSKY: Jeff, what do you think happened to your granddaughter?

HANSON: I think -- this has been my contention since the first week, I think Justin had an accident with Trista. Nobody wants to believe that someone could do this purposely.

PINSKY: Danine, I wonder if you have a question for Jeff.

MANETTE: I do. I want to know how long the baby had been in his care when the baby`s arm was broken, because I`m trying to figure out how long she`d been there before she had her first accident.

HANSON: Well, the total time was 59 days. I believe it was months before she went missing. When she had the accident was November 17th, I believe.

PINSKY: Jeff, I`ve got to say, we`re going to have to take a break. Please stay with us. I`m going to keep Jeff. I`m going to keep the panel. And again, I`m talking to people who`ve been involved in these horrific cases. I hear the anguish in poor Jeff`s voice, and I`m sure it was all enflamed today by the court situation. Stay with us. We`re going to continue this conversation.

{Snipped as unrelated to Ayla}

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PINSKY: Back with the "Behavior Bureau," my co-host, Jenny Hutt, and we are going to look at Baby Ayla`s mother at the court house confronting Dipietro`s mother and Dipietro, himself. There she is. Janine, I wonder if you had a chance to look at this footage and what your thought. I would say, I see a desperate mom. I certainly see that. What do you see?

JANINE DRIVER, HUMAN LIE DETECTOR: Well, first of all, not only I see a desperate mom, but we hear her say "our daughter." You know, we spoke recently where someone didn`t say -- the baby in the microwave, the woman never said my baby or my daughter. Here she says, "our daughter," which is ownership. This tends to be someone who is telling the truth.

Now, with him, again, we`re not seeing this anger. We actually see a little bit of a smile on him. You see him raise his hands up over his head. This is like I give up, but the baby`s mom, Ayla`s mom is very interesting, very confrontational. Look, right in the mother`s face, the baby daddy`s mom`s face. Right there, confrontational.

However, Dr. Drew, I want to caution you, just because she`s aggressive and confrontational does not mean she`s not involved. Think about who is confrontational and aggressive that was a liar. Lance Armstrong. Lance Armstrong confrontational to the point where he sued people, destroyed their lives.

This is what we call gas lighting. Gas lighting is when one person attacks the other and we automatically give them the benefit of the doubt.

PINSKY: Yes, I get that. I hear you, Janine. I understand that, but my gut tells me something a little different. I appreciate you bringing that up. I`ve got on the phone Jeff Hanson who`s Baby Ayla`s step grandfather, the stepfather of the mom.

And Jeff, I`m going to ask you a crazy question, first off. The people have been sort of pointing at your stepdaughter and her extent in treatment for chemical dependency. To my eyes, she looks like a person who is secure in her sobriety. Am I right on that?

HANSON: Correct.

PINSKY: Yes. And so, that`s an issue for her. He, on the other hand, I`m not so sure. I don`t want to -- I can`t -- I`m purely speculating, I don`t know these people, but has that been a part of the problem here?

HANSON: You mean on Justin`s side?

PINSKY: Well, I don`t want to -- we can`t confirm or really confirm any of this. I don`t want to speculate, but I just wonder if, you know, -- I just feel like drugs and alcohol are sort of a cornerstone problem in all of this. And I feel like your stepdaughter is doing something about it. I`m not sure anybody else is.

HANSON: Well, let me tell you what I left out of the case -- actually, let me respond to what the previous caller -- I didn`t get the name -- they say police had stated publicly that a kidnapping did not take place. So, that rules out Trista, period.

And what -- in answer to your question, I left out -- what I left out, when I was putting it together, was one of the statements that the investigators said to Trista when they showed her this evidence was the (INAUDIBLE) that was littered with beer bottles. One of the detectives commented the house -- it looked like a hoarder`s house.

PINSKY: Hang on, Jeff. Casey, I wonder if you have a question for Jeff. Do you see the kind of road we`re going down here?

CASEY JORDAN, CRIMINOLOGIST: Yes, I do. I`m with you, Dr. Drew, on the idea that I think that Trista`s made enough progress in her recovery where she`s overcome her guilt, because she was in rehab. Is that correct? I want to ask her grandfather that. She was in rehab when Ayla went missing, correct?

HANSON: That is correct.

(CROSSTALK)

JORDAN: And she`s doing well now is what you`re saying. Yes. I think that Trista has made enough progress in her recovery. She actually feels like she has the upper hand over Justin and has the courage to get in his face over what she`s always believed.

PINSKY: Right.

JORDAN: But she couldn`t do that from a moral standpoint when she was having trouble with substance abuse.

PINSKY: Right. She --

JORDAN: So, that`s just clarity.

PINSKY: You`re right. Shame and guilt has lifted a little bit in her recovery. Jenny, you want to talk about this?

JENNY HUTT, ATTORNEY: Yes. I just want to say one thing to Janine. Janine, I understand that gas lighting thing you were talking about before, but if anyone gas lit, it was the police, it was the people who told her about the evidence and lit the fire under her. And so, she, to me, justifiably went at Justin. Every mother would go at Justin, right?

SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Well, yes, and not only that, let`s talk about the fact that Justin failed his polygraph test. He took out a life insurance policy on Baby Ayla like weeks before that she was reported missing. Come on!

PINSKY: Janine, finish me up.

DRIVER: I just want to say --

(CROSSTALK)

DRIVER: There`s no definitive tell when someone is being deceptive, but at the end of the day, I put my money on Justin. There`s more to the story there. But you`ve got to keep an open mind.

PINSKY: Speaking of gas lit, I`ll give Danine the last word?

MANETTE: Yes. I still think we need to go after Courtney. She`s a mom, and she doesn`t want to lose her kid. She doesn`t want her kid taken away from her. She may have been involved. She needs to cut a deal with the D.A. and talk and they need to go after Courtney.

(CROSSTALK)

PINSKY: Danine is into the thumb screws, guys.

(CROSSTALK)

MANETTE: Yes, yes, yes.

PINSKY: Thank you, Danine --

MANETTE: You have to squeeze.