Jodi Arias--Trial for the murder of Travis Alexander #15

the advances in the medical, sciences, and education fields are crazy in the last 1.5 decades... I graduated HS in 1991... My girls are in HS now and holy crap the hoops they have to jump thru just to graduate. they're packing alot more in for them to learn and some of the standards are high... then you have college, probably more of the same... then the research that has advanced in recent years that the new batch of drs. or whoever is getting educated on... How can JW make the connection that Dr. D probably wasn't born in 1980 so she couldn't of supervised AL... AL is working from a 1950's text book, Dr. S too... the younger generation is bringing more to the table, they're bright, not burning out... Don't try and discount her experience and knowledge because she's younger then your experts...

i missed if Dr. Drew's jurors (katie wick) said how the jury was responding to Dr. D?

Bmore wrote:the advances in the medical, sciences, and education fields are crazy in the last 1.5 decades... I graduated HS in 1991... My girls are in HS now and holy crap the hoops they have to jump thru just to graduate. they're packing alot more in for them to learn and some of the standards are high... then you have college, probably more of the same... then the research that has advanced in recent years that the new batch of drs. or whoever is getting educated on... How can JW make the connection that Dr. D probably wasn't born in 1980 so she couldn't of supervised AL... AL is working from a 1950's text book, Dr. S too... the younger generation is bringing more to the table, they're bright, not burning out... Don't try and discount her experience and knowledge because she's younger then your experts...

Lol, Just look around you everyone. Hubby lost job when the economy tanked and has been on the job hunt ever since to get back in his field, applying for literally hundreds of jobs.
LOTS of employers out there now are WAY younger than the people working for them! Not only that but ALV is a dinosaur---I'm sorry---It's not her age---it's the fact that she doesn't have the educational background that Dr. D. does, and that she hasn't troubled herself to keep current in her field. 35 yrs. experience means nothing if you keep on using methods long out of date, don't get more education, and if your integrity is for sale and your opinions vary depending on a hefty fee!

18, i think of Dr. D as that little square thing that plugs in your phone so you can take credit card payments any where and the person itinitals with their finger... AL and Dr. S are that old heavy thing you had to put the card in, then the carbon form, slide the impression roller over the card/paper, fill in the $$$ amount, have the person sign then throw away the carbon sleeve, give them the yellow copy and keep the white...

Pianist wrote:

Bmore wrote:that was nice too... someone mentioned yesterday that we got thru the full direct of this 1 witness that relates to the Dt's 2 witnesses and we never heard or saw anything about:
anal sex
blow jobs
ky jelly
JA's cooch, bung and tittays
broken finger

hmmm what else...

Right on. I know people tend to think that we more mature women cringe at the sex talk. Of course Alyce was a woman who presented that idea, but really with my having 8 children, 13 grandchildren, and 2 greatgrandchildren I think I can say in all honesty that I have heard it all. BUT I have never heard it for 38 days straight. I was so so happy to hear a more intellectual discussion yesterday. There are just so much anyone can take. The DT case was like having to swim through a septic tank. Unless someone is addicted to sex (like KN) the sex talk got old.

Lol, agree!

from fb... yesterday's weather alert


Sara Crew - WEATHER ALERT: Heatwave to hit Texas today...all the hot air just left Arizona as the defense rests in the JA case.

Bmore wrote:18, i think of Dr. D as that little square thing that plugs in your phone so you can take credit card payments any where and the person itinitals with their finger... AL and Dr. S are that old heavy thing you had to put the card in, then the carbon form, slide the impression roller over the card/paper, fill in the $$$ amount, have the person sign then throw away the carbon sleeve, give them the yellow copy and keep the white...

Bmore wrote:the advances in the medical, sciences, and education fields are crazy in the last 1.5 decades... I graduated HS in 1991... My girls are in HS now and holy crap the hoops they have to jump thru just to graduate. they're packing alot more in for them to learn and some of the standards are high... then you have college, probably more of the same... then the research that has advanced in recent years that the new batch of drs. or whoever is getting educated on... How can JW make the connection that Dr. D probably wasn't born in 1980 so she couldn't of supervised AL... AL is working from a 1950's text book, Dr. S too... the younger generation is bringing more to the table, they're bright, not burning out... Don't try and discount her experience and knowledge because she's younger then your experts...

But that's all JW has to huff and puff about, Bmore. lol
And even with that, she couldn't get the doctor/doctor/license order correct

girl on fb wrapped it up nicely... basically do you want state of the art or primitive?

funny this morning getting ready I was thinking about this, probably because every pay channel on FIOS is playing all the men in black movies...

Dr. D - New hotness
Dr. S & AL - Old busted...

lol

someone help me here, been googling and can't 'get' the comparison... JA hopes her IQ score is as high as Einstein's. But everything i read says that these tests are new and AE never took one so they don't know what his score would be... So is she just saying she hopes she scores at a genius level or is she not as smart as she thinks and said something really dumb?

Dteam likely spent all their evening to prepare a JW's blitz, I hope Dr DeMarte will have the nerves to support it...

Hopefully the Dt will take a page from Jose Baez book of bullsh!t.... We know they follow social media just like JB and they would gear their questioning style based on what the public would say. If the public was outraged of treatment then the jury could be too... JW needs to make this short and sweet, I think Dr. D humanized JA and leave it at that...

Bmore wrote:someone help me here, been googling and can't 'get' the comparison... JA hopes her IQ score is as high as Einstein's. But everything i read says that these tests are new and AE never took one so they don't know what his score would be... So is she just saying she hopes she scores at a genius level or is she not as smart as she thinks and said something really dumb?

IQ and Einstein are contemporary so AE could have been tested, even it seems he never was. But I don't think that JA was aware of that and went so far. I think it's just because in common sense Einstein is a genius, so he must have had one of the highest Iq of humankind. Now she has the answer, her IQ is not bad but far from the highest.

JA and her book yesterday... at one point i did see her start shading in a section of the page like holding the pencil lower to use most of the point and going back and forth and made like an unoutlined rectangle... she's doodling, doing it on purpose to show disrespect... I heard a few times that the jury is watching her...

JA's parents have their answer now... not bi-polar... her ups and downs are too fast and different... Wonder how that hit her when she got back to her hotel room last night? she's stone faced in court when she isn't cutting up with her sister... Cried in the interview room... there is emotion....

Bmore wrote:JA's parents have their answer now... not bi-polar... her ups and downs are too fast and different... Wonder how that hit her when she got back to her hotel room last night? she's stone faced in court when she isn't cutting up with her sister... Cried in the interview room... there is emotion....

Told ja! I wrote a few days ago that she wasn't. I was once married to someone who had hereditary bi-polar---horrendous. J's symtoms just not the same, but like hers, there would have been a long time pattern as well.
ALV and Dr. S never did boo to check into J's history, and the DT didn't want them to!

18.... like the angry email yesterday.... talk about the Dt sweeping things under the rug...

Bmore wrote:18.... like the angry email yesterday.... talk about the Dt sweeping things under the rug...

Not sure what you're talking about?? Oh, you mean Jodi's rage filled email to T. where she is talking about her temper??
Holy cow, I was just blown out of the water. Can you imagine them hiding that, or thinking they could get away with that never coming out?!!
I was just furious at how they had Alyce painting Travis like he was Jack the Ripper for calling chica a sociopath and saying that she was the worst thing that ever happened to him, and all the while they are sitting on this bombshell from JODI! GRRRRRRR....I was furious. Bet the jury is too, lol!


I KNEW JUAN WAS SAVING A FEW BOMB SHELLS FOR HIS REBUTTAL! Bet we'll see a few more!

I think for whatever reason JW likes to go over every word in a witnesses CV, her witness or not... JM went over the basics, she'd educated, experienced in abuse, sexual offenders, and disorders. she's qualified to be here, did it in like what 5 minutes? I wonder if JW thinks he did it so fast because he's trying to hide something... I would imagine the Dt has access to all of this stuff...

on direct the email when JA talked about her anger problems... I heard bits of it but FB is talking about it...

carlakay wrote:this folks is an expert..Wilmott is coming across as a rude high school girl...jeeeeeez

Wilmott didn't seem prepared yesterday, today she is going to come charged (with all the tips from JAII folks ). It may not amount to anything in the end - but will cause frustration. I hope Dr. DeMarte stays strong.

Freckles wrote:

Weeziethm wrote:Just-y or anyone....I have a question. Can someone diagnosed with BPD as Dr D has said for JA, can they also have narcissism and sociopathy "in addition" to BPD. My thought is if the answer to that is "yes", this is what JM is going to tie in and line up with Travis' 5/26 email labeling JA as such.

Send her a PM to confirm, Weezie. IIRC, from other testimony, a person may have a mixture of other personality disorders. Not sure how that works. Maybe it is like Sociopaths and borderline personalities are in column one and historian narcissists are from column two? Or maybe they are ALL in column one! I know I heard there can be a mix, however. Anxious to hear what Just can tell us.

does this remind us of anyone.... and there is a co-morbidity with this disorder...



At first, a Borderline female may appear sweet, shy, vulnerable and "ambivalently in need of being rescued"; looking for her Knight in Shining Armor.

In the beginning, you will feel a rapidly accelerating sense of compassion because she is a master at portraying herself as she "victim of love" and you are saving her. But listen closely to how she sees herself as a victim. As her peculiar emotional invasion advances upon you, you will hear how no one understands her - except you. Other people have been "insensitive." She has been betrayed, just when she starts trusting people. But there is something "special" about you, because "you really seem to know her."
http://www.bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a101.htm

http://outofthefog.net/Disorders/Comorbidity.html
good reading...

Bmore wrote:I think for whatever reason JW likes to go over every word in a witnesses CV, her witness or not... JM went over the basics, she'd educated, experienced in abuse, sexual offenders, and disorders. she's qualified to be here, did it in like what 5 minutes? I wonder if JW thinks he did it so fast because he's trying to hide something... I would imagine the Dt has access to all of this stuff...

She was accusatory yesterday when talked about the CV being not updated. I loved Dr D's answer. Someone in her position would not spend valuable time updating her CV on a weekly basis. JW believes she can throw dirt around and some will land on this witness. Won't work IMO. You see no one can see any dirt except the dirt that at the defense table. That dirt is the big elephant in the room and I am sure JM will continue to focus on it.

18thcenturylady wrote:

Bmore wrote:JA's parents have their answer now... not bi-polar... her ups and downs are too fast and different... Wonder how that hit her when she got back to her hotel room last night? she's stone faced in court when she isn't cutting up with her sister... Cried in the interview room... there is emotion....

Told ja! I wrote a few days ago that she wasn't. I was once married to someone who had hereditary bi-polar---horrendous. J's symtoms just not the same, but like hers, there would have been a long time pattern as well.
ALV and Dr. S never did boo to check into J's history, and the DT didn't want them to!

When you watch the interviews with mom ... she has the same vocal patterns as Jodi... flips around on thought... instantly went to blame... etc I wonder if mom is BPD as well

JAO... maybe... that test on the othe page said I was "likely" which I don't get... lol

Jodi Arias Trial, Recap of Yesterday's Proceedings:

Expert: Arias has a 'personality disorder'

By Graham Winch
updated 8:40 AM EDT, Wed April 17, 2013

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/04/16/live-blog-has-arias-defense-saved-her-life

Bmore wrote:I didn't get to see all of it yesterday... did she go thru all the scales that were high? what was the basic outcome? I heard the BPD... I thought it as usual was crappy of the Dt to nit-pick Dr. D's education since JM didn't spend a day on it... She's qualified to be there or she wouldn't be... And the you didn't feel compassion for the abused kids you worked with? Really? A human is going to feel something, that doesn't mean you have to throw your career away for them... Assess their situation and recommend or give them the help they need. Get their family to give that support they need not you as a therapist so they're confused on who they should trust or who they get close to... She's very black and white when it comes to personal and business and as an expert that's what you need, someone there to just do the job...

Others on here are more qualified (& succinct!) to answer your psych ?s...

But just wanted to agree w/your impressions of her testimony. Heard from many sources yesterday, commenting that yes, she is relatively young (JW: were you even born in 1980 etc...imo the jurors likely have working eyeballs and can tell without JW's cross that ALV is older & take whatever they want away from that), was a little nervous (so what imo- my guess is that would just make her even more 'accessible'/jury can empathize)...

As many of you have said in other ways, Dr. D is making (as a forensic psych. NOT an author/lecturer ALV) as OBJECTIVE/SCIENTIFIC/IMPARTIAL assessment of JA as is humanly possible. How refreshing to have such testimony. My only wish for JM is that he is able to better illustrate that difference- even with Dr. D's relative youth, she (imoo) is MUCHMUCH better qualified to make an assessment of JA. I get that the dteam wants to 'humanize' the snake JA, but since her defense is completely built around her otherwise UNcorroborated claim of self-defense...an OBJECTIVE clinical assessment is what should be regarded with the highest weight...in making judgements about her guilt.

Agree with all that appreciate her professionalism. Dr. D is what I expected the dteams experts to be, albeit w/a different spin. My bet is the jury has some common sense of their own, and however JW tries to snark Dr. D's qualifications down a la JM, they'll weigh her professional, clinical experience and objective judgement as more important than her age. Oh, and plus she just plain speaks to what is clear to us laypeople- JA is full of crap and is a cold, calculated psycho murderer that's trying to game the system and wish her way outta this mess.

Bmore wrote:i haven't really seen anything but this was mentioned either here or FB... about JW 'bald' spot? has it changed thru the trial? do you think she has stress related alopecia?

Actually, due to the camera angle, it really stood out yesterday. IMO, she may have altered her part slightly. Because we value a full head of hair (and lock our identities to our locks) it may be distressing for her having to deal with hair loss.

Pianist wrote:

Bmore wrote:I think for whatever reason JW likes to go over every word in a witnesses CV, her witness or not... JM went over the basics, she'd educated, experienced in abuse, sexual offenders, and disorders. she's qualified to be here, did it in like what 5 minutes? I wonder if JW thinks he did it so fast because he's trying to hide something... I would imagine the Dt has access to all of this stuff...

She was accusatory yesterday when talked about the CV being not updated. I loved Dr D's answer. Someone in her position would not spend valuable time updating her CV on a weekly basis. JW believes she can throw dirt around and some will land on this witness. Won't work IMO. You see no one can see any dirt except the dirt that at the defense table. That dirt is the big elephant in the room and I am sure JM will continue to focus on it.

Did she really say that! Lol! I think Dr. D has been well schooled by Juan on what to expect and how to handle it. She's also a very smart cookie. I just feel badly because I know JW will drag this out beyond all reason and that it will be tedious and nerve wracking in the extreme for Dr. D. and the jury, and everyone else out there watching this.
I can't understand how the defense lawyers can get thru school and where they are without realizing certain things are REALLY going to turn the jury off, and garner nothing but irritation for them and for Jodi!

my daughter got really sick a few years ago and always had nice thick hair... a few months later it started falling out, not like bald spots but overall was about 1/2 at thick. Since it was so thick to begin with it still looked normal... took her to the drs and they said her illness shocked her body and this happens sometimes... when it grew back in her hair is now about 1 1/2 times as think, she hates how thick it is, totally different... I was just curious if it could be as a result to this case and having to work with JA..

Freckles wrote:

Bmore wrote:i haven't really seen anything but this was mentioned either here or FB... about JW 'bald' spot? has it changed thru the trial? do you think she has stress related alopecia?

Actually, due to the camera angle, it really stood out yesterday. IMO, she may have altered her part slightly. Because we value a full head of hair (and lock our identities to our locks) it may be distressing for her having to deal with hair loss.

I noticed it for the first time yesterday while hubby and I were watching Juan question Dr. D...I feel very badly for anyone with this problem. I lost half my hair. Tried everything out there for 10 year. No luck. Every test. Dr. could never find out WHY...It's very terrible to live with.

Remember when I was describing JA and I mentioned what looked like part of a candy bar in a white napkin or something just under the edge of the computer in front of her? I looked during direct yesterday and it was gone---JW on sugar high for cross?? lol!

well on the bright side if JW drags this out forever... Dr. D has the knowledge & techniques to help calm her annoyed nerves to get past this... lol

One other thing- jmoo, but I was very impressed with how Dr. D handled the sneaky-snark from JW; have heard comments (not here don't think, elsewhere) that Dr. D was too snippy. I disagree, imo she was strong, held her own...with the biggest difference (between her attitude on cross versus dteam witnesses on cross) SHE ANSWERED THE QUESTIONS!!! Dr. D didn't get all defensive and try to make jokes/show disrespect...I appreciated her assertiveness and restraint. Jmo...

Off Topic:

Just wanted to shout out that Master Blob Bashara has been charged with 1st Degree Murder!

ANOTHER trial I will be following!

i know this name... why?

justanopinion wrote:

18thcenturylady wrote:

Told ja! I wrote a few days ago that she wasn't. I was once married to someone who had hereditary bi-polar---horrendous. J's symtoms just not the same, but like hers, there would have been a long time pattern as well.
ALV and Dr. S never did boo to check into J's history, and the DT didn't want them to!

When you watch the interviews with mom ... she has the same vocal patterns as Jodi... flips around on thought... instantly went to blame... etc I wonder if mom is BPD as well

Watching the mother in the gallery, her gossiping, swigging of water, constant writing, etc., and I feel something is not right there. IMO, the father knows it, too. It is like her actions are so inappropriate it is freakish Is she facing the reality of what her dau has done, where JA is/mother is right now, and what the future may hold for JA and her family? Or is this all a vacation joke?

Thank you, JAO, for that link which gave an excellent summary of what is going on for a BPD in a love relationship.

Snipped: How a Borderline Personality Disorder Love Relationship Evolves

This pattern usually evolves through three stages: The Vulnerable Seducer, The Clinger, and The Hater. This evolution may take months, and sometimes even years to cycle through. In the later periods, the personality often swings wildly back and forth from one phase to the next.

http://www.bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a101.htm

Listen, if I had this one odd bald spot on my head, I would not be having my hair parted on that side.

Why not just flip the hair over there and cover it up?

Mari 68 wrote:Off Topic:

Just wanted to shout out that Master Blob Bashara has been charged with 1st Degree Murder!

ANOTHER trial I will be following!

Yay! Me too, Mari. I have followed this case since THM. Feel so bad for his 2 children.

Bmore wrote:i know this name... why?

He hired the mentally retarded handy-man to stomp on his wife's neck in the garage and then drive her to car into Detroit and leave it for someone to find.

Blob Bashara - Master

He was about to close escrow on another house in his neighborhood with his two love slaves.

the clinger... lol... my kids tell me about the love gossip at school... and this one girl... wow... i said she was a stage 5 clinger... lol

what the hell? I remember the name from THM... I'll have to read up on that one...

Bmore wrote:my daughter got really sick a few years ago and always had nice thick hair... a few months later it started falling out, not like bald spots but overall was about 1/2 at thick. Since it was so thick to begin with it still looked normal... took her to the drs and they said her illness shocked her body and this happens sometimes... when it grew back in her hair is now about 1 1/2 times as think, she hates how thick it is, totally different... I was just curious if it could be as a result to this case and having to work with JA..

I had a high fever when I was a child. It had lasting impact upon me, too. My hair fell out and came back a different color! (IMO, maybe it was "aged"? My sibs were all fair haired when young and the color slowly deepened with time. I lost the fair hair and it just came in dark all at once.) Remind your dau: When others are losing their hair, she will still have beautiful locks.

Mari 68 wrote:Off Topic:

Just wanted to shout out that Master Blob Bashara has been charged with 1st Degree Murder!

ANOTHER trial I will be following!

Wow Mari, that is absolutely terrific! I thought with his plea, it was done. So happy to hear this!

what was the deal with Dr. Karp? was that someone the Dt had evaluate JA and escaped the net of a ruined career?

JW 'bald spot': not sure if it bald...looked to me like she needs her roots done (lotsa gals her age have white hair, especially in front crown area)...

Her hair is definitely all over colored, with a few highlights...usually if it's alopecia (bald spot) the area would look pinkish rather than white...can tell that she does have a good deal of white/gray in her hair just from the translucent brown throughout.

Jmo...the camera/lighting could be affecting my perspective too...

Left untreated, does BPD typically became worse with time? When does it really show up as something obviously different? Is it related to the changes in hormones as the person matures, has babies, etc?

Bmore wrote:what was the deal with Dr. Karp? was that someone the Dt had evaluate JA and escaped the net of a ruined career?

I want to know too...I had never heard of her in relation to this case until yesterday.

Wonder if JW busting on Dr. D's time/experience could be put in perspective for her... Length of time doesn't mean you're good... I mean JW has a job, been working a while and she sounds like she's arguing the debate club in HS... years doesn't = experience...

Must be Dr. Karp found Jodi to be a liar, too.

Hence, the DT not calling on her.