George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin Case -- General Discussion #6

Alessandra_Deux wrote:

ellejay wrote:

--we do not...we thought it was the ex, but in her stmt released yesterday she said that she didn't feel that he had it in for african americans, played ball w/ blacks, hispanics etc....---and yet witness #9 was quoted as saying ""But I know George, and I know that he does not like Black people..."

--so---we're back to, hmmmmmmmm...who are you witness #9?

--(it could possibly be an ex-girlfriend (rather than fiancee) b/c she does say that she knows the family well etc...)

"George Zimmerman's lawyer is fighting to keep prosecutors from releasing to the public a statement by "witness 9," an unidentified person who's told authorities he's a racist.

But prosecutors now say they may use it at Zimmerman's trial if they need to rebut certain defense claims, presumably evidence attempting to show he is not hostile to blacks.

In paperwork released Monday, Assistant State Attorney Bernie de la Rionda did not spell out what witness 9 told authorities, but he described it as information about his "bias against black persons," including an unspecified "act."

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-07-02/news/os-george-zimmerman-witness-9-20120702_1_prosecutors-statements-witness

Remember that Veronica Zuazo, his ex- fiance, said that George was spending too much time with a single mother?

Your link references an "act".. and witness 9 is clearly afraid...

--IF---judgeL "disqualifies" himself---there are 3 judges in line to replace him.

Judge Marlene M. Alva
Judge Donna McIntosh
Judge Debra Steinberg Nelson

--(are they wanting judgeL OFF, or a female judge ON..?)

--(attorney) richardH seems to think it would go to judge debra nelson. ( i believe she's also the judge in shellie's perjury case....)

http://twitter.com/RichardHornsby

Richard Hornsby‏@RichardHornsby
@Tammybaby65 No, I think ‪#Zimmerman‬ has good shot, Judge Lester didn't mince words and Lester would probably be happy to hand off case.

BigBoithedog @Tammybaby65 Technically, there is no limit to how many judges you can ask to step aside IF you can allege grounds.

Richard Hornsby‏@RichardHornsby
@Tammybaby65 Technically, it would be by luck of the draw. But I suspect that Judge Nelson will end up with case...

I said at the time when Judge Lester made the comment he beleived GZ was thwarted in his attempts to flee with other peoples money but couldnt because of ankle moniter.That if a Judge said that about me I would demand his removeall...I think the Judge wants off the case an hence he made those unprofesinall remarks..I M O GZ Had no intention of fleeing..Where could he go? Mexico?Canada..He wouldnt be hard to find travelling under his own name.GZ Has neither the street smarts or the work ethic to start a new life...Even the money he had up to that point wasnt enough to set him up with a new identity false papers ect.If he had intended to flee he wouldnt have informed M O M OF HIS RAINYDAY NEST EGG.A rental car rented in his own name an a ice cooler with drinks an snacks isnt a surviveal kit.He is no uni bomber able to live of the land an disssapear into the wilderness..GZ Is a wimp whom thinks he is going to beat this rap so fleeing was never on his mind..J Lester wants out of this political hot potato an will recuse himself M O O.

i HOPE If J Lester does remove himself a woman Judge replaces him.After al Trayvon was a child an a Female Judge will have strong maternal instincts towards an inoccent child...Are any of thease Female Judges African American? That would be great if he ends up with a female African American Judge with children Trayvons age..M O M will be spitting feathers an yet will have to suck it up.An the Last Refuge of Scoundrels blog will be shouting Foul from the roof tops.

Jeff Weiner ‏@JeffWeinerOS
Breaking: Prosecutors object to #GeorgeZimmerman's motion to disqualify Judge Lester. #TrayvonMartin

State will release Witness 9 statement, some of ‪#GeorgeZimmerman‬'s jail calls Monday at 11 a.m.

Jeff Weiner‏@JeffWeinerOS
We will not get a formal copy of the prosecution objection until next week, SAO spokeswoman says. ‪#GeorgeZimmerman‬ ‪#TrayvonMartin‬

ellejay wrote:
Jeff Weiner ‏@JeffWeinerOS
Breaking: Prosecutors object to #GeorgeZimmerman's motion to disqualify Judge Lester. #TrayvonMartin

State will release Witness 9 statement, some of ‪#GeorgeZimmerman‬'s jail calls Monday at 11 a.m.

Jeff Weiner‏@JeffWeinerOS
We will not get a formal copy of the prosecution objection until next week, SAO spokeswoman says. ‪#GeorgeZimmerman‬ ‪#TrayvonMartin‬

Florida rules and statute regarding disqualifying a judge:

38.10 - Disqualification of judge for prejudice; application; affidavits; etc.
Whenever a party to any action or proceeding makes and files an affidavit stating fear that he or she will not receive a fair trial in the court where the suit is pending on account of the prejudice of the judge of that court against the applicant or in favor of the adverse party, the judge shall proceed no further, but another judge shall be designated in the manner prescribed by the laws of this state for the substitution of judges for the trial of causes in which the presiding judge is disqualified. Every such affidavit shall state the facts and the reasons for the belief that any such bias or prejudice exists and shall be accompanied by a certificate of counsel of record that such affidavit and application are made in good faith. However, when any party to any action has suggested the disqualification of a trial judge and an order has been made admitting the disqualification of such judge and another judge has been assigned and transferred to act in lieu of the judge so held to be disqualified, the judge so assigned and transferred is not disqualified on account of alleged prejudice against the party making the suggestion in the first instance, or in favor of the adverse party, unless such judge admits and holds that it is then a fact that he or she does not stand fair and impartial between the parties. If such judge holds, rules, and adjudges that he or she does stand fair and impartial as between the parties and their respective interests, he or she shall cause such ruling to be entered on the minutes of the court and shall proceed to preside as judge in the pending cause. The ruling of such judge may be assigned as error and may be reviewed as are other rulings of the trial court.

RULE 2.330. DISQUALIFICATION OF TRIAL JUDGES

***

(d) Grounds. A motion to disqualify shall show:

(1) that the party fears that he or she will not receive a fair trial or hearing because of specifically described prejudice or bias of the judge; or

(2) that the judge before whom the case is pending, or some person related to said judge by consanguinity or affinity within the third degree, is a party thereto or is interested in the result thereof, or that said judge is related to an attorney or counselor of record in the cause by consanguinity or affinity within the third degree, or that said judge is a material witness for or against one of the parties to the cause.

(e) Time. A motion to disqualify shall be filed within a reasonable time not to exceed 10 days after discovery of the facts constituting the grounds for the motion and shall be promptly presented to the court for an immediate ruling. Any motion for disqualification made during a hearing or trial must be based on facts discovered during the hearing or trial and may be stated on the record, provided that it is also promptly reduced to writing in compliance with subdivision (c) and promptly filed. A motion made during hearing or trial shall be ruled on immediately.

***

(g) Determination — Successive Motions. If a judge has been previously disqualified on motion for alleged prejudice or partiality under subdivision (d)(1), a successor judge shall not be disqualified based on a successive motion by the same party unless the successor judge rules that he or she is in fact not fair or impartial in the case. Such a successor judge may rule on the truth of the facts alleged in support of the motion.
(h) Prior Rulings. Prior factual or legal rulings by a disqualified judge may be reconsidered and vacated or amended by a successor judge based upon a motion for reconsideration, which must be filed within 20 days of the order of disqualification, unless good cause is shown for a delay in moving for reconsideration or other grounds for reconsideration exist.
(i) Judge’s Initiative. Nothing in this rule limits the judge’s authority to enter an order of disqualification on the judge’s own initiative.
(j) Time for Determination. The judge shall rule on a motion to disqualify immediately, but no later than 30 days after the service of the motion as set forth in subdivision (c). If not ruled on within 30 days of service, the motion shall be deemed granted and the moving party may seek an order from the court directing the clerk to reassign the case.

BBM

Now I am reading the bolded to be that once a party has had a judge disqualified, they cannot do it again - but was MOM's first motion made under (d) (2) and not (d) (1)????

Yep, his earlier motion was under (d)(2), so he can do it.

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/motion_to_disqualify.pdf

Good I hope the prosecutors do object to a new judge, the judge rules on the fact of the case and I really hope he doesn't get a new judge. My client lied to the court the court found him a liar because of evidence presented, so because we don't think the judge ruled in our favor we want a new judge. The judge would not have to write the order if his client would not have lied to court. The judge did give him bail it just was higher then they would have liked for lying to court.

CherokeeNative wrote:

Now I am reading the bolded to be that once a party has had a judge disqualified, they cannot do it again - but was MOM's first motion made under (d) (2) and not (d) (1)????

--omara's 1st motion to have judge reckseidler step aside was made under 2330 (d) (2).

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/motion_to_disqualify.pdf
--omara motion to disqualify judge reckseidler.

--according to richardH, you can ask again and again------IF--you have grounds to do so.

http://twitter.com/RichardHornsby

BigBoithedog @Tammybaby65 Technically, there is no limit to how many judges you can ask to step aside IF you can allege grounds.

ahhhh...i thought there would be the 3 (female)choices.....apparently there is only the ONE.

Jeff Weiner‏@JeffWeinerOS

Only felony judge left in Seminole County who hasn't yet been on ‪#GeorgeZimmerman‬ case is Debra Nelson. Her bio:
http://www.flcourts18.org/bio_nelson_sem.html

--wouldn't it be a 'conflict' of some sort though----since she's shellie's perjury case judge?

sharona wrote:Witness #9 is afraid of George.. She sounds to anxious and credible.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv4HTrJ4lb8

Wow. Statement called in 2 days after Trayvon's murder. Before GZ was arrested. She DOES seem familiar with the family.

Interesting comment from that site. Anyone know?

"There are stains on the front of his boots but not on the heels. That reflects a person who is on top and not a person who is lying in a supine position where stains would show on the back of the jeans and boots.

THEI FAM in reply to xy11xy (Show the comment) 5 days ago"

ellejay wrote:

CherokeeNative wrote:

Now I am reading the bolded to be that once a party has had a judge disqualified, they cannot do it again - but was MOM's first motion made under (d) (2) and not (d) (1)????

--omara's 1st motion to have judge reckseidler step aside was made under 2330 (d) (2).

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/motion_to_disqualify.pdf
--omara motion to disqualify judge reckseidler.

--according to richardH, you can ask again and again------IF--you have grounds to do so.

http://twitter.com/RichardHornsby

BigBoithedog @Tammybaby65 Technically, there is no limit to how many judges you can ask to step aside IF you can allege grounds.

I agree Ellejay - what I was trying to say is usually, the first time you don't need ANY reason, but after that you do. And yeah, technically, even if he had already done a motion under (d)(1) you can keep motioning, but you better have good grounds, or it could be ruled frivolous and subject the attorney to sanctions I would imagine. Thing is, MOM's earlier motion was under (d)(2), so in effect, this is his first motion for ANY reason. I hope I am explaining myself clearly. Let me just say, in California, a party can paper the judge in the case just because he doesn't like his hair color (teasing) and in fact, doesn't have to give a reason, once by right - but all subsequent motions to disqualify have to be for good cause shown. Florida's rules and statutes are worded a little differently, but I am reading them in that same light. I am thinking Judge Lester will have no choice to step aside since MOM hasn't filed a (d)(1) motion previously.

I agree with everyone else though - it sucks because this is GZ's fault for lying. The Judge just called it as he saw it - if it quacks like a duck...

Freckles wrote:

sharona wrote:Witness #9 is afraid of George.. She sounds to anxious and credible.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv4HTrJ4lb8

Wow. Statement called in 2 days after Trayvon's murder. Before GZ was arrested. She DOES seem familiar with the family.

Interesting comment from that site. Anyone know?

"There are stains on the front of his boots but not on the heels. That reflects a person who is on top and not a person who is lying in a supine position where stains would show on the back of the jeans and boots.

THEI FAM in reply to xy11xy (Show the comment) 5 days ago"

There is another statement from Witness 9 that will be released on Monday.. She's a mother. O'Mara fought this one.. Could be very damaging to George..

I think George has secrets.. like cheating on his wife in 2010 and in 2004, Robert and Gladys Zimmerman had George’s name removed from the deed to a house in Lake Mary.

The mentoring that he did for black children, was that part of his community service to get the assault charged dropped?

ecossie possie wrote:I said at the time when Judge Lester made the comment he beleived GZ was thwarted in his attempts to flee with other peoples money but couldnt because of ankle moniter.That if a Judge said that about me I would demand his removeall...I think the Judge wants off the case an hence he made those unprofesinall remarks..I M O GZ Had no intention of fleeing..Where could he go? Mexico?Canada..He wouldnt be hard to find travelling under his own name.GZ Has neither the street smarts or the work ethic to start a new life...Even the money he had up to that point wasnt enough to set him up with a new identity false papers ect.If he had intended to flee he wouldnt have informed M O M OF HIS RAINYDAY NEST EGG.A rental car rented in his own name an a ice cooler with drinks an snacks isnt a surviveal kit.He is no uni bomber able to live of the land an disssapear into the wilderness..GZ Is a wimp whom thinks he is going to beat this rap so fleeing was never on his mind..J Lester wants out of this political hot potato an will recuse himself M O O.

Hi, Ecossie! The fact that George is not very smart is the very reason that he would think that he could flee. George told Shellie to hold on to/keep the current passport and, imo, that the only reason he turned over the new passport & the money from paypal is that O'mara learned of the amount coming in. I just bet the state informed O'Mara that there was another passport. And, good grief, everyone able to receive news from the outside world knew about George's paypal account.

sharona wrote:

Freckles wrote: Wow. Statement called in 2 days after Trayvon's murder. Before GZ was arrested. She DOES seem familiar with the family.

Interesting comment from that site. Anyone know?

"There are stains on the front of his boots but not on the heels. That reflects a person who is on top and not a person who is lying in a supine position where stains would show on the back of the jeans and boots.

THEI FAM in reply to xy11xy (Show the comment) 5 days ago"

There is another statement from Witness 9 that will be released on Monday.. She's a mother. O'Mara fought this one.. Could be very damaging to George..

I think George has secrets.. like cheating on his wife in 2010 and in 2004, Robert and Gladys Zimmerman had George’s name removed from the deed to a house in Lake Mary.

The mentoring that he did for black children, was that part of his community service to get the assault charged dropped?

I've read that his mentoring was a part of his diversion program to avoid having the Assault charge on his record....but, I have not looked at the actual Order to confirm that.

Just to remind everybody, right after the 2nd bond hearing, the GZimmerman fans on at least one of the sites (tree-house?) where I dared to read, were not calling for Lester's recusal/removal, but rather Omara's. I cannot recall if we discussed this briefly. I have not (don't wanna) go back there to see if that kind of talk is still going on, but if it is, this move by MOM would be diversionary, to take the heat off himself, yes? no?

I recall the same thing - they were calling for MOM's head, not Lester's. I just think it is unconscionable that MOM is asking for Lester to step aside. GZ got exactly what he deserved. I will be interested to see how the prosecution objects and under what grounds. It seems almost like GZ is judge shopping to the extent that he wants the Judge to take no position on his lying to the Court. It just makes me wonder how a reviewing Court would rule if Lester refused to step aside... This could get very interesting before it's all over.

Rule 2.330 states in part:

"If the motion is legally sufficient, the judge shall immediately enter an order granting disqualification and proceed no further in the action. If any motion is legally insufficient, an order denying the motion shall immediately be entered."

Florida Statute 38.10 states in part:

"If such judge holds, rules, and adjudges that he or she does stand fair and impartial as between the parties and their respective interests, he or she shall cause such ruling to be entered on the minutes of the court and shall proceed to preside as judge in the pending cause. The ruling of such judge may be assigned as error and may be reviewed as are other rulings of the trial court."

Here is some good reading on the subject put out by the Florida Bar Assn.:

Initial and Successive Disqualification Motions
If an initial disqualification motion alleges a fear of prejudice or bias under rule 2.160(d)(1), the trial judge is required to determine only the “legal sufficiency” of the motion and is prohibited from passing on the truth of the facts averred. See Fla. R. Jud. Admin. 2.160(f). Indeed, the only reason a judge can properly give for denying a disqualification motion other than a procedural deficiency is that the motion is “legally insufficient.” Id. In the event a trial judge expresses another reason for denying the motion or “takes issue” with the motion either personally or through counsel, the judge is required to disqualify himself regardless of the insufficiency of the motion.7 As observed by the Supreme Court in Bundy v. Rudd, 366 So. 2d 440, 442 (Fla. 1978), the purpose of this prohibition is to prevent the creation of an “intolerable adversary atmosphere” between the trial judge and the litigant. Some appellate courts have broadly interpreted the phrase “passing on the truth of the facts” so as to strictly enforce the prohibition against disputing the facts alleged in the motion. For example, in Rowe-Linn v. Berman, 601 So. 2d 618 (Fla. 4th DCA 1992), the Fourth District held that since it “feared” that the trial judge “stepped over the line” by attempting to justify the denial of a disqualification motion on grounds other than legal sufficiency, disqualification was required.8 This was so even though the appellate court felt that the disqualification motion was legally insufficient. Id. at 619. On the other hand, it has been held that if the trial judge merely explains the status of the record when determining the disqualification motion, the judge has not contested the allegations contained in the motion and disqualification is not required.9 Similarly, when a judge did not deny making the remarks which formed the basis for a recusal motion, but rather merely stated that he was quoted out of context, the appellate court upheld the judge’s denial of the motion.10

Section (g) of rule 2.160 deals with the filing of successive disqualification motions so as to prevent the possibility of an abuse of the disqualification rule, such as “judge-shopping.” The rule provides that if an initial judge has been disqualified on the ground of alleged prejudice or partiality, the successor judge cannot be disqualified on a successive motion by the same party “unless the successor judge rules that he or she is in fact not fair or impartial in the case.” Unlike the first judge, the successor judge is permitted to pass on the truth of the facts alleged in support of the successive motion. Additionally, under rule 2.160(h) a successor judge may reconsider, vacate, or amend any prior legal or factual rulings of a disqualified judge. This is accomplished by the filing of a motion for reconsideration within 20 days of the order of disqualification. Id. The 20-day period for filing a motion for reconsideration may be extended upon a showing of good cause for a delay in moving for reconsideration or where other grounds for reconsideration exist. Id.

What Are “Legally Sufficient” Motions?
Even assuming that a disqualification motion meets the procedural requirements set forth in Fla. R. Jud. Admin. 2.160 and F.S. §38.10, it nevertheless must be denied if not “legally sufficient.”11

More at Link: http://www.floridabar.org/divcom/jn/jnjournal01.nsf/Author/E76978A5AA65A20585256ADB005D631E

Having read "What are 'Legally Sufficient' Motions" in this article, I am not too sure it will be that easy for MOM to get Judge Lester recused. The prosecution may just win this one. JMHO.

Freckles wrote:

sharona wrote:Witness #9 is afraid of George.. She sounds to anxious and credible.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv4HTrJ4lb8

Wow. Statement called in 2 days after Trayvon's murder. Before GZ was arrested. She DOES seem familiar with the family.

Interesting comment from that site. Anyone know?

"There are stains on the front of his boots but not on the heels. That reflects a person who is on top and not a person who is lying in a supine position where stains would show on the back of the jeans and boots.

THEI FAM in reply to xy11xy (Show the comment) 5 days ago"

Listening to witness #9's statements in the video @ apprx 2:15 it sounds to me like she goes to speak of Gz as.....MY ______......like I would hate for MY cousin/nephew/brother/sister/aunt/husband...to get away with this.

She speaks as the whole family being I guess we are speaking of prejudiced....but she almost called Gz...my ______. Also, isn't the new evidence supposed to have something about an "act"???

Before this doc dump I had photo's of Gz taken at police HQ'er's in the clothes he wore committing the crime.....and now I cannot find them. The one's that have disappeared are a photo taken from his backside full length body....I scrutinized it for the supposed grass stains,ect on his top.......also there were several of his lower jeans up close front view.....AND his shoes front view with grass on the toes of his shoes......I thought I book marked them here....http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery?index=os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-sh-067......
but, they are not there now. I could not determine from the views of the lower legs of his pants and shoes....side view and back view...his pants were too long and covered the view....I even thought the pants should have stains where he stepped on them in the rain. AND I was carefully looking at the grass on the toes of the shoes with the thought...this proves he was on top of Trayvon...but, could not be sure.

Does anyone know any other series of photo's that I am speaking of?

Meet Judge Lester.

http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/04/19/meet-the-new-judge-handling-george-zimmermans-case/

He sounds like an all around good guy.

angela_nw wrote:Just to remind everybody, right after the 2nd bond hearing, the GZimmerman fans on at least one of the sites (tree-house?) where I dared to read, were not calling for Lester's recusal/removal, but rather Omara's. I cannot recall if we discussed this briefly. I have not (don't wanna) go back there to see if that kind of talk is still going on, but if it is, this move by MOM would be diversionary, to take the heat off himself, yes? no?

--yes...they were incredibly disappointed in omara----b/c he was such a wimp and would NOT come out and say "our client is INNOCENT!!!!!"

--b/c of this, they were disgusted that ( he WILL use the media to ask for our $$$'s...but...) they ( and i mean some of them) decided to hold back on donations until he would flat out FIGHT FOR GEORGE! PUBLICLY!!!

--right after the bond ruling---sites were also flipping out at judgeL ---( and suggesting that omara&co get rid of him.)

--it looks like omara ( went away to colorado for a weekend "break" after george was released on bond...) ---rather than do his usual media-drive ( where he might/would say something to further alienate their $$$$$upporters)---the defense then took an entire week off not saying anything (stupid)---

---and ta da!!!

--it's friday $$$$upporters! here ya go!!--( i'm staying, b/c you appear to be over the "get rid of omara"..)-----but here's our motion (per your other $$$uggestion) to get rid of the judge!

--how do you like us now??? ---(again...)

CherokeeNative wrote:

sharona wrote:

There is another statement from Witness 9 that will be released on Monday.. She's a mother. O'Mara fought this one.. Could be very damaging to George..

I think George has secrets.. like cheating on his wife in 2010 and in 2004, Robert and Gladys Zimmerman had George’s name removed from the deed to a house in Lake Mary.

The mentoring that he did for black children, was that part of his community service to get the assault charged dropped?

I've read that his mentoring was a part of his diversion program to avoid having the Assault charge on his record....but, I have not looked at the actual Order to confirm that.

--Cher----i'm pretty sure that we hunted around for the Order---couldn't find one. we did hear (rumour!) from elsewhere that other people/their friends/relatives have had diversionary programs, and HAD to do that child mentoring------NOT to say that the same happened or was in effect for george.

Hinky Refugee wrote:

Freckles wrote: Wow. Statement called in 2 days after Trayvon's murder. Before GZ was arrested. She DOES seem familiar with the family.

Interesting comment from that site. Anyone know?

"There are stains on the front of his boots but not on the heels. That reflects a person who is on top and not a person who is lying in a supine position where stains would show on the back of the jeans and boots.

THEI FAM in reply to xy11xy (Show the comment) 5 days ago"

Listening to witness #9's statements in the video @ apprx 2:15 it sounds to me like she goes to speak of Gz as.....MY ______......like I would hate for MY cousin/nephew/brother/sister/aunt/husband...to get away with this.

She speaks as the whole family being I guess we are speaking of prejudiced....but she almost called Gz...my ______. Also, isn't the new evidence supposed to have something about an "act"???

Before this doc dump I had photo's of Gz taken at police HQ'er's in the clothes he wore committing the crime.....and now I cannot find them. The one's that have disappeared are a photo taken from his backside full length body....I scrutinized it for the supposed grass stains,ect on his top.......also there were several of his lower jeans up close front view.....AND his shoes front view with grass on the toes of his shoes......I thought I book marked them here....http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery?index=os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-sh-067......
but, they are not there now. I could not determine from the views of the lower legs of his pants and shoes....side view and back view...his pants were too long and covered the view....I even thought the pants should have stains where he stepped on them in the rain. AND I was carefully looking at the grass on the toes of the shoes with the thought...this proves he was on top of Trayvon...but, could not be sure.

Does anyone know any other series of photo's that I am speaking of?

HR - to me, she sounds like she is saying "might" not "my"....but I could be wrong. Try listening again and see if you hear what I do. Also, I do know the pics you are talking about, as we have all seen them. As for the photos, look in here: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery

ellejay wrote:

CherokeeNative wrote:

I've read that his mentoring was a part of his diversion program to avoid having the Assault charge on his record....but, I have not looked at the actual Order to confirm that.

--Cher----i'm pretty sure that we hunted around for the Order---couldn't find one. we did hear (rumour!) from elsewhere that other people/their friends/relatives have had diversionary programs, and HAD to do that child mentoring------NOT to say that the same happened or was in effect for george.

Remember the documents that BDLR submitted at the first bond hearing regarding GZ's prior crimes? Would it have been in that stack? And if so, shouldn't it be in the Court documents? I haven't looked for them but now you have me curious. :-)

The pics of GZs dirty toes and some other great stuff I could not read (not mobile friendly) was at Axiom- something. Sorry l can't be more precise, willmpost later. They have a site and a FB page. Good Stuff.

CherokeeNative wrote:

Hinky Refugee wrote:

Listening to witness #9's statements in the video @ apprx 2:15 it sounds to me like she goes to speak of Gz as.....MY ______......like I would hate for MY cousin/nephew/brother/sister/aunt/husband...to get away with this.

She speaks as the whole family being I guess we are speaking of prejudiced....but she almost called Gz...my ______. Also, isn't the new evidence supposed to have something about an "act"???

Before this doc dump I had photo's of Gz taken at police HQ'er's in the clothes he wore committing the crime.....and now I cannot find them. The one's that have disappeared are a photo taken from his backside full length body....I scrutinized it for the supposed grass stains,ect on his top.......also there were several of his lower jeans up close front view.....AND his shoes front view with grass on the toes of his shoes......I thought I book marked them here....http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery?index=os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-sh-067......
but, they are not there now. I could not determine from the views of the lower legs of his pants and shoes....side view and back view...his pants were too long and covered the view....I even thought the pants should have stains where he stepped on them in the rain. AND I was carefully looking at the grass on the toes of the shoes with the thought...this proves he was on top of Trayvon...but, could not be sure.

Does anyone know any other series of photo's that I am speaking of?

HR - to me, she sounds like she is saying "might" not "my"....but I could be wrong. Try listening again and see if you hear what I do. Also, I do know the pics you are talking about, as we have all seen them. As for the photos, look in here: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery

Looking at George's hands you would think he would have some defensive wounds if he was trying to defend himself from a person who was beating him from an inch of his life. If his head was being banged on the side walk you would attempt to put your hands behind your head to stop it from hitting sidewalk. His hands look to go for I guy who was trying to defend himself from assault.

CherokeeNative wrote:

Hinky Refugee wrote:

Listening to witness #9's statements in the video @ apprx 2:15 it sounds to me like she goes to speak of Gz as.....MY ______......like I would hate for MY cousin/nephew/brother/sister/aunt/husband...to get away with this.

She speaks as the whole family being I guess we are speaking of prejudiced....but she almost called Gz...my ______. Also, isn't the new evidence supposed to have something about an "act"???

Before this doc dump I had photo's of Gz taken at police HQ'er's in the clothes he wore committing the crime.....and now I cannot find them. The one's that have disappeared are a photo taken from his backside full length body....I scrutinized it for the supposed grass stains,ect on his top.......also there were several of his lower jeans up close front view.....AND his shoes front view with grass on the toes of his shoes......I thought I book marked them here....http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery?index=os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-sh-067......
but, they are not there now. I could not determine from the views of the lower legs of his pants and shoes....side view and back view...his pants were too long and covered the view....I even thought the pants should have stains where he stepped on them in the rain. AND I was carefully looking at the grass on the toes of the shoes with the thought...this proves he was on top of Trayvon...but, could not be sure.

Does anyone know any other series of photo's that I am speaking of?

HR - to me, she sounds like she is saying "might" not "my"....but I could be wrong. Try listening again and see if you hear what I do. Also, I do know the pics you are talking about, as we have all seen them. As for the photos, look in here: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-pictures-evidence-photos-released-in-the-shooting-death-of-trayvon-martin-20120517,0,6090406.photogallery

Tx CN...but those do not have the 3 photo's I studied so long about 5 or more days ago. I'll keep searching :) The tape....I don't know...my pet peeve is LE talking over and interrupting a witness....we miss so much. Back to looking for my missing 3 photo's :)

George Zimmerman Interrogation
Over one hour.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJzKYeX0DLI&feature=related

--- Signs left hand
--- Said he went to work, the doctor, a psychologist
--- Said his wife is a mess; asked the officer if GZ could call his wife; was told no; was able tp cpntact Shellie within 6 minutes
--- GZ said he did not have MRI or scans at that time
---GZ said the scans cost money; yes, he does have insurance

--GZ said his father is retired, Army; GZ says when he was a child, he was in the pharmacy. They had a check list of things you could get without cost (over the counter medication) so GZ said he checked off everything and was given a bag full of the items. He told his father what he got for free: his father told him to never forget--- NOTHING is free; Father said he had paid for it with his service. (I have serious doubts items such as over the counter drugs would be given free to a child.)

---GZ: Makes "small talk" with the investigator. Ask her if she had rec an email he had sent to the chief stating she had had gone above and beyond re the NW activities;

@15:12 The interrogation begins

GZ states the drugs he takes (Liberol and adderall and Tanazopan and (sp for all the drugs) Acknowledges he has ADHD.

-- Asks to see back of GZ' head: States it does not look too bad

--Explains GZ will be taking a computer generated stress analysis

-- Has GZ sign paper prior to taking the stress test
Long time explaining functions of the test

-- He explains to GZ there are 9 questions GZ will be asked

--@25:19 GZ states he has a need to drink water and asks if that is okay; also states his nose is broken

-- GZ: Left his house to go to store to buy groceries for the week; store is Target; leaving neighborhood when he saw this guy walking slowly in front of house, looking toward the house, GZ knew he didn't live there so he was looking a little bit suspicious and he kept staring around, said he kept looking around and at GZ; and it was raining, and he didn't look like he was in a rush to get out of the rain, he didn't look like he was hardcore physical exercising -- looked out of place from what GZ says he was told in NW so GZ drove past him and went to the club house. GZ called the non-emergency number

-- While on the non emergency number, GZ states (TM) walked past GZ CAR and GZ lost visual contact; says the office asked GZ if GZ could get to somewhere GZ could see or give a direction as to where (TM) was headed; GZ said yes and he pulled out, drove adjacent to the club house, and GZ was unfamiliar with the street names

-- GZ says the operator asked GZ what street he was on, GZ told her he didn't know, operator said they needed to know, operator wanted to know what house he was in front of, GZ told operator directions to where he was, at this point the guy walked around his car (HUH? WHEN DID THE GUY RETURN?) had his hand in his waist band; GZ didn't hear anything if the guy said anything because the windows were rolled up and GZ was on the phone with the dispatcher; and )TM) disappeared back through the ??? between the houses. While he was doing that, the operator asked GZ what exact address he was at; GZ said all the the houses were the back of town houses so he didn't know; operator said needed to know what street GZ in on and the address; GZ gave them his home address and then he got out of his car to look for a street sign; no street sign and GZ could not make out the house number because there was a big PU truck in front of it; GZ saw him walk through the cut through and make a right so GZ knew if he went straight and did not cut through where he went, that was the street GZ lived on, ??? Circle, GZ knew if he got to that street he could tell them the house number and street where he was at so as GZ walked through, he looked to the right where TM had gone through. The operator said, Are you following him?" and GZ said, " Yes. " And the operator said, "We don't need for you to do that." And GZ said, " Ok." And GZ said he walked through to the other end of the street to give them the address, and as GZ said, "He's not here any more. He's gone." And they said, "You don't see him?" And GZ said, "No. He's gone." And they asked if GZ still wanted an officer dispatched, by this time GZ said he had gone to Retreat Circle.

--And they asked if HZ still wanted a PD officer sent out; and GZ said yes; and they asked where did GZ want the officer to meet me; GZ said for the officer to go to the club house, make a left, and GZ gave them a description of his car; told dispatch he would meet officers back at his car.

--GZ walked through again. GZ was about half way through when , uh... "he appeared out of nowhere"

He had hung up. GZ said the dispatch said they had an officer en-route. And GZ said he put his phone away.

This takes you to the 30.25 mark of the tape.
I will finish this later.

--

HR - Try here: http://trayvon.axiomamnesia.com/trayvon-zimmerman-case-photos/?album=1&gallery=1

Hinky Refugee---

See if the pics are in this batch:
http://www.craigboyce.com/w/2012/05/trayvon-martin-crime-scene-photos/

Elle: AxiomAmnesia.com


Good links- pics of Gz feet....gotta run!

...you guys give me a headache.
You all know where to find exactly what someone is looking for. If one doesn't know, the other does. Have I told you how appreciated you all are lately? CN, Ellejay, what we would do without you? OK, going back to read whatever you all are talking about and try to get caught up.

I am so lost. Can someone tell me if and where there is a discussion on the motion to recuse Lester?

Porky wrote:I am so lost. Can someone tell me if and where there is a discussion on the motion to recuse Lester?

Sorry Porky I found it hours ago but lost it :(

Porky wrote:I am so lost. Can someone tell me if and where there is a discussion on the motion to recuse Lester?

Right here Porky - It isn't anywhere else that I am aware of.\

Here's the motion: http://www.scribd.com/doc/100020949/Motion-to-Disqualify-Lester

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv4HTrJ4lb8[/quote]

Thanks for posting that video sharona, I probably messed the quotes up though so wanted to credit your post.

Hinky Ref~

That recording is chopped in a few places so some words are cut off. I hear might, it gets cut off but I think she was going to say might. She is really upset and has witnessed, IMO, some bizarre (at least to the civilized mind)racial hatred from GZ's family. She says all of them are like that, Quote, "It's in his blood". Sad. She sounds like she's crying, she says, "I'm a mom", her heart is broken for Sybrina.

---here are a few of the pics of george @ SPD the night of the 26th taken from sites provided by Cher, Freckles, Bonnie...

--(the back of his jacket does NOT look to me like it was worn by someone who had been seriously! squirming on the grass in a fight for his life----i also don't see the 'wet w/ grass stains"..)

Hinky Refugee wrote:

Porky wrote:I am so lost. Can someone tell me if and where there is a discussion on the motion to recuse Lester?

Sorry Porky I found it hours ago but lost it

--reposting this helpful tip by Justice4All to help you not "get lost" and find your way back if you are!

J4A---

a quick way to keep up with all discussions in this case is the following:

Go to the top of the page after you finish reading the thread you clicked on. A quick way to go to the top is to click any of the BLUE up arrows next to any of the posts.

Click on actions right above the page numbers at the top right of the thread.

Click View posts since last visit.

If there are any new posts in this case, there will be a small orange box with an arrow to the left of the topic title.

Click the small orange box to go to the first new post since you last read that particular topic. If there is more than one thread showing an orange box, you can right-click the orange boxes and open the threads in separate tabs.

--you will only get the posts/threads pertaining to the thread--in this case anything george zimmerman/trayvon.

--and can easily determine which thread to go to ( lately it's been only the "doc dump" thread and "general discussion" mainly..)

--we had been discussing judgeL's "disqualification in the "general" thread.

--if you are ever looking for a particular Motion, document, etc-----"Alessandra" is doing a fantastic job of moving them over to the george zimmerman/trayvon Library when anything is posted...(thanks Ales!)----------just click on LIBRARY in the blue box along the top of the page and you'll see it there...

Many thanks Ellejay. I still find is very user unfriendly. I am at work during the day so the old way was easier because I just do not have the time to jump around sometimes.

--markNJ's take on the disqualification motion:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1207/13/ebo.01.html
--july 13/2012---ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT

--snipped--

And now, new developments tonight in the case against George Zimmerman. Defense attorney Mark O'Mara has filed a motion to disqualify the judge. Kenneth Lester is his name and Mark O'Mara says he's biased against Zimmerman. He said this after he made what O'Mara is called gratuitous and disparaging remarks in his bail order last week.

Including and I quote, "Under any definition, the defendant has flouted the system." And, I quote again, "The defendant has tried to manipulate the system when he has been presented the opportunity to do so." Those and other remarks are what the defense says will prevent Zimmerman from getting a fair trial.

CNN legal analyst Mark NeJame is OUTFRONT.

Mark, do those statements, flouted the system and manipulating the system, do you agree with Mark O'Mara, that those are gratuitous and disparaging? Or are those fair ways to describe someone who when asked if he had money said no and he really did have money?

MARK NEJAME, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I think it's a fair comment from a court who's evaluating the evidence, one can agree or disagree. But you can't throw a judge off every time you disagree with him because basically you'd have half the judges thrown off at any given time, because somebody typically is going to be on the other side.

The fact is, is that, you know, the question will be did the judge go too far to suggest that he's in fact, might be biased? I don't think the judge is biased at all.

However, in order for the defense to claim that, down the line in the event there's an appeal, you have to first raise it. So, if it's not raised in this forum, then it's forever waived. So, I think the defense has no option if they truly believe in a good faith believe what they've alleged, and I believe that's their position --

BURNETT: And, Mark, you know this judge personally, right?

NEJAME: I know the judge. I know the defense lawyer. Yes, I know them all, for a long time.

BURNETT: So you believe when you look at this person, Mr. Lester, his integrity, the way he would handle this, you think he's fair?

NEJAME: I think he's without re reproach. I think he did go pretty far in that order. And I think that's the basis of the defense motion, that they're claiming that the judge went further than he needed to go. He could have simply granted the bond and moved on. But the judge interpreted a lot of things. Basically, he said that he believed Zimmerman was going to flee because of the dishonesty he associated with the moneys that were obviously in a fund that were not disclosed to the court.

So the judge took some leaps there. But I think that's within his right to do so.

BURNETT: So who decides? So, you know, Mark O'Mara makes this motion. But who decides whether the judge stays or goes?

NEJAME: The judge.

BURNETT: The judge?

NEJAME: There's already one recuse, you may remember that Recksiedler, the wife my law partner, first got off the case.

BURNETT: Yes.

NEJAME: You basically get one free bite of the apple. The second one, the judge basically has to agree with the motion. And if the judge doesn't agree, then the remedy for the defense is to take it to an appellate court on a petition for a writ of prohibition and go to the appellate court, which here is in Daytona. My partner Eric Barker assisted me on this to get this ready for you all.

But basically, they will make a determination whether the judge is -- they'll be looking at the facts to see if the judge in fact shows bias.

BURNETT: Right.

NEJAME: There's an assumption of correctness in the judge's order. So, it's hard to overturn.

BURNETT: So, let's just -- OK, sorry. So, let's just say the judge remains on this case. And now the -- George Zimmerman's attorney is asked to be removed. Doesn't this put George Zimmerman's entire case, entire trial, put him at a disadvantage? The judge, if he doesn't already dislike him would, even if he didn't want to be biased, he obviously would have reason to be, even if kind of in the back of his mind --

NEJAME: You know, I don't think so. You know, we all -- we can fight against each other. We can be in trial against each other for a week and we can be duking it out and then go out to dinner with each other. It's just the way you're set up when you do this. And none of this is personal.

So I didn't hear any -- I didn't see any personal attacks on the judge. I simply said what I heard and what I read is basically that there was a suggestion that in light of the judge's ruling that they believe there's bias.

They filed their motion. It wasn't a personal attack. It was a legal motion that suggested that the judge was biased.

But no, I don't think they'll be anything lingering. This judge I think calls it down the middle. He's done that. He's known for that for his entire career.

BURNETT: Right.

NEJAME: And I don't think it's going to impact it one way or another

Freckles wrote:George Zimmerman Interrogation
Over one hour.

{snipped}

--

Thanks Freckles for transcribing it!

eta: and thanks elle for the NeJame transcript! I like Mark, he's pretty cool about answering questions from people on Twitter. He sticks to the legalities and sometimes has to give the emotional, crazy people (from both sides) 'time-outs'. lol

serenaz1 wrote:

Freckles wrote:George Zimmerman Interrogation
Over one hour.

{snipped}

--

Thanks Freckles for transcribing it!

You are welcome.

I will try to finish it tomorrow.Have to have it quiet in the house so I can focus.

ellejay wrote:---here are a few of the pics of george @ SPD the night of the 26th taken from sites provided by Cher, Freckles, Bonnie...

--(the back of his jacket does NOT look to me like it was worn by someone who had been seriously! squirming on the grass in a fight for his life----i also don't see the 'wet w/ grass stains"..)

OMGOSH Let me hug you Ellijay! These are my lost photo's. I so wanted to look at them again after reading George had been allowed to go to the bathroom and wash up! TY so much! I saw them before the doc dump Thursday and kept saying to myself ok this guy has not been on his back in freshly soaked grass! You are awesome! Make me ashamed to even try to search for stuff...I just find stuff, lose it, then think I am nuts lol.... :awe:

Hinky Refugee wrote:

OMGOSH Let me hug you Ellijay! These are my lost photo's. I so wanted to look at them again after reading George had been allowed to go to the bathroom and wash up! TY so much! I saw them before the doc dump Thursday and kept saying to myself ok this guy has not been on his back in freshly soaked grass! You are awesome! Make me ashamed to even try to search for stuff...I just find stuff, lose it, then think I am nuts lol....

--you're welcome "hinky"...i just grabbed a few pics for you from the links Cher, Freckles and Bonnie provided....(hug them!)

--yep...his clothing certainly doesn't look like it's been dragged all over the sidewalk/lawn...in the rain no less.

--and let's take a look at his hands shall we------THESE (prissy things w/ absolutely NO cuts/marks/scratches) just fought off an aggressor that was in the process of killing him?..uh huh.

ecossie possie wrote:I said at the time when Judge Lester made the comment he beleived GZ was thwarted in his attempts to flee with other peoples money but couldnt because of ankle moniter.That if a Judge said that about me I would demand his removeall...I think the Judge wants off the case an hence he made those unprofesinall remarks..I M O GZ Had no intention of fleeing..Where could he go? Mexico?Canada..He wouldnt be hard to find travelling under his own name.GZ Has neither the street smarts or the work ethic to start a new life...Even the money he had up to that point wasnt enough to set him up with a new identity false papers ect.If he had intended to flee he wouldnt have informed M O M OF HIS RAINYDAY NEST EGG.A rental car rented in his own name an a ice cooler with drinks an snacks isnt a surviveal kit.He is no uni bomber able to live of the land an disssapear into the wilderness..GZ Is a wimp whom thinks he is going to beat this rap so fleeing was never on his mind..J Lester wants out of this political hot potato an will recuse himself M O O.

Great insight, ecossie. And I totally agree. I think all of the little "leaks" (like Lester's comment about the evidence being strong, and the odd- imo- comments about GZ planning to flee-- like THAT would be a realistic plan, lol!) are little bones thrown out to the defense....like, "if you want a different judge, so be it-- here is an excuse". Most judges who are asked to recuse themselves seldom dig in their heels and challenge the request, from what my sources tell me. To vigorously oppose a request to recuse themselves is to lay grounds for a messy appeal.

If Lester isn't on the trial, another good judge will be. For sure, another judge will be "different", but not necessarily better or "worse" than Lester. It's a roll of the dice-- but I'm sure there is speculation as to who is up to bat next.

I'm not worried about a new judge. I'd be very surprised if JLester stayed on to an actual trial. I have thought that he would have to be replaced from the time that he indicated his anger with GZ's lying-by-omission in the bondgate scandal, with "the evidence is strong against him"-- totally in opposition to what he had JUST ruled when he GRANTED bond the first time. Judge Lester has tipped his hand as to which side he leans toward-- and that says to me that he wouldn't be heartbroken to be "off" the case. The leaking of his leaning (lol) was pretty intentional. A judge of his caliber does NOT make mistakes when he parses his words.

**Calling Marinade Dave.....just wondering...do you know Judge Lester personally? Has he called you lately?**

KZ wrote:. .....post snipped.....

If Lester isn't on the trial, another good judge will be. For sure, another judge will be "different", but not necessarily better or "worse" than Lester. It's a roll of the dice-- but I'm sure there is speculation as to who is up to bat next

--from what we've heard, there's one choice.....judge debra nelson:



http://www.flcourts18.org/bio_nelson_sem.html
--judge debra nelson bio

--she's also presiding over shellie's perjury case.

Thanks, ellejay! Well, if JL does recuse himself, she looks to have impeccable credentials.

It will be ok-- I'm confident in the judges. Any of them can do a good job with this case.

ecossie possie wrote:I said at the time when Judge Lester made the comment he beleived GZ was thwarted in his attempts to flee with other peoples money but couldnt because of ankle moniter.That if a Judge said that about me I would demand his removeall...I think the Judge wants off the case an hence he made those unprofesinall remarks..I M O GZ Had no intention of fleeing..Where could he go? Mexico?Canada..He wouldnt be hard to find travelling under his own name.GZ Has neither the street smarts or the work ethic to start a new life...Even the money he had up to that point wasnt enough to set him up with a new identity false papers ect.If he had intended to flee he wouldnt have informed M O M OF HIS RAINYDAY NEST EGG.A rental car rented in his own name an a ice cooler with drinks an snacks isnt a surviveal kit.He is no uni bomber able to live of the land an disssapear into the wilderness..GZ Is a wimp whom thinks he is going to beat this rap so fleeing was never on his mind..J Lester wants out of this political hot potato an will recuse himself M O O.

Ecossie - I, too, was taken by Judge Lester's statement about "fleeing" in his ruling on the 2nd bond; I believe I may have said words to the effect that "the Judge can't read minds".

Sharing some excellent interactive analysis of the crime scene map from an individual JD at the following link: http://frederickleatherman.wordpress.com/2012/07/13/zimmerman-case-who-uttered-the-terrified-scream-for-help-punctuated-by-a-gunshot/

Following is cut & paste from JD's posting.

the investigator’s evidence map has been released, and myself and others have produced overlays with google maps, google earth, etc to better illustrate what is shown and contrast the evidence with George’s many conflicting statements.

Here is photo analysis of the total crime scene map, which by the way vindicates my own estimates almost completely, IMO. (I missed the location of the first aid kit by less than ten feet)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeandodge/

here is another, NOT mine but that confirms what we both independently arrived at

https://2img.net/h/oi48.tinypic.com/esndqf.jpg

If you are curious about all the measurements, go to google maps and use the ruler to to estimate distances.

ecossie possie wrote:I said at the time when Judge Lester made the comment he beleived GZ was thwarted in his attempts to flee with other peoples money but couldnt because of ankle moniter.That if a Judge said that about me I would demand his removeall...I think the Judge wants off the case an hence he made those unprofesinall remarks..I M O GZ Had no intention of fleeing..Where could he go? Mexico?Canada..He wouldnt be hard to find travelling under his own name.GZ Has neither the street smarts or the work ethic to start a new life...Even the money he had up to that point wasnt enough to set him up with a new identity false papers ect.If he had intended to flee he wouldnt have informed M O M OF HIS RAINYDAY NEST EGG.A rental car rented in his own name an a ice cooler with drinks an snacks isnt a surviveal kit.He is no uni bomber able to live of the land an disssapear into the wilderness..GZ Is a wimp whom thinks he is going to beat this rap so fleeing was never on his mind..J Lester wants out of this political hot potato an will recuse himself M O O.

However, when a desperate person is facing basically life in prison they can do impulsive things. Zimmerman is not above doing impulsive things. His mother is from Peru, he could have easily went there. Lets not forget that Zimmerman can very well pass for middle eastern, whether he would want to go to one of those countries or not would not be the point, anything would be better than being in prison for the rest of your life. Zimmerman knows he lied and he knows exactly where he lied and that eventually these lies will be coming out at trial and that his life is going to depend on 12 people, 12 people from FLORIDA. I don't think that Zimmerman is willing to take that chance and would very well run if given the opportunity.

I don't believe that Zimmerman thought that he would ever be arrested, that his word would be taken and that Tryavon was probably a thug and had a long record with the law. But when he WAS arrested and it was found out that Trayvon BELONGED where he was and didn't have a record nor any history of being a thug, Zimmerman started going in his pants. I do think that he would have run when he saw that things weren't going his way but it was thwarted when they put a braclet on him. George also thought that by his life being threatened that he would be allowed to leave the state (which he was) and that the court wouldn't put a tracking device on him because of this, thus making it very possiblw for him to flee.

One of the purposes of a bond is so that a prisoner's family would have to put up their home etc. and insure that the suspect would show up for court. When Zimmerman lied about the money he deceived the court, then to top it off he lied about his passport and told his wife to hold onto it. This would cause any judge to lable him a flight risk.

Think of it this way, had the judge continued George on a low bond with no monitor and George fled, can you imagine the uproar that would have been directed at the judge after those jailhouse tapes were publicized? Everything that Goerge and his wife did thru those jail house tapes indicated that George was hiding the money AND his passport. George could have esily slipped into Mexico or Canada and then fled to anywhere he desired without being detected.

SP grew a mustach and a beard and dyed his hair to try and disguise himself. Zimmerman already had a mustach and a bold head, so he shaved and grew his hair (the opposite) to try and disguise himself (in my books). I think he was going to try and pull it off but O'Mara discovered the pay pal account and George didn't have the opportunity to run if things got tuff. JMO